Need Help with purchase

[irayone]

Hi all out looking at a few boats this weekend I have come across a 2001 26 X I have been looking mainly at the 26M. Please tell me about the swing keel?? as apposed to the new 26 M dagger boad ??

[Kelly Hanson East]

Swing keel - the centreboard on an pivots from the forward point and has a long, skinny aspect ratio (approx 6:1)

Advantages - allows adjustment of the centre of lateral resistance while trimming the boat, kicks up if it hits bottom.

Daggerboard - the daggerboard drops straight up and down, easy to deal with if you have a problem (pulls up from top if required) -
also the only option available on the safer, slower, blue hull

[Chinook]

The M's daggerboard also necessitated a major reconfiguration of the boat's interior. Head moves forward, and Vee birth becomes too small for adults to sleep in. To compensate for that, I think the M has more headroom in the aft birth area. I suggest you look at both configurations, and consider how you intend on using the boat. Each model has its advantages, and enthusiasts.

[irayone]

The boat will mostly be used as a catalina cruiser always had a fixed wine glass keel the x keel seems alittle flimsy from what I am used to. Looking at 6 boats this week and a demo at the factory with Mike. By next week I will let you know about the new boat.

[hart]

One of the major advantages of a swing keel is shallow water sailing. It may not be an issue in your area but around here things get quite shallow at times. I've "grounded" my X a couple times. Thank goodness the board just kicks up and it's been over either sand or mud.

Like Chinook said, two different configurations so you can choose what best fits your needs. I think they're both pretty, I like the rotating mast etc on the M but the X interior just fits my family and I couldn't be happier with it for us. Plus, paying for a used X upfront beat all heck out of financing and equipping a new M for me.

Enjoy the search and take your time. When you find the right boat and the right deal you'll know it.

[Chinook]

Compared with fixed keels, the swing keel on the X is indeed flimsy. However, I'm not aware of many problems with it. It does have an irritating habit of clunking loudly when at anchor. I'd like to be able to leave it down to help dampen the rocking motion of the boat, but the clunking is too distracting for me, so I raise it. The swing design does protect it from damage in shallow waters. I have read here of several M keels getting broken when hitting the bottom while underway. The only problem I've ever had with our swing keel involved a piece of driftwood which somehow got jammed up inside the keel trunk. I didn't realize it was there, and the keel would occasionally jam, and refuse to drop down. It was a real pain getting that wood out of there. I've also read of other owners having problems with the cable or rope which raises and lowers it.

[dutchwinter]

I also recently had the dilemma of picking between the and . aside from the faster blue hull, we had to think about the mast, and all that implies. The main thing for us was the layout of the interior I think. To us the M seems unique in its layout. The way that the front berth and head are arranged, seems more private. The sliding galley as is may be a detraction, but either way, both are platforms for upgrades in my opinion. ultimately We chose the blue hulled M. which is being made next week. I just got the hull number from Bill WOOOOOOHOOOOOOOO! If money was a big concern I think I may have bought a used X, most of the used Ms I've seen are so high in price that I didn't see much advantage in purchasing one of them. though becasue I went new, I think that I wont have it fully outfitted the way I want for a few years, so there's that to consider as well. I'm going to sail a bit, and see what I feel like I'm missing, then add it, then see how that goes. I expect that process to last maybe as long as I have the strength to sail, hehe. good luck with your decision.

[School House Steve]

The M's daggerboard also necessitated a major reconfiguration of the boat's interior. Head moves forward, and Vee birth becomes too small for adults to sleep in. To compensate for that, I think the M has more headroom in the aft birth area. I suggest you look at both configurations, and consider how you intend on using the boat. Each model has its advantages, and enthusiasts.

I respectively disagree, ALL the Magregor boats as well as early Ventures had the head forward in the boat with the exception of Venture 21 which had no head. Only the X deviated from this design. My favorite sleeping area is the vee berth and find it cozy and well ventilated by the forward hatch. All the boats with swing keels have a floor hump where the keel is stored in the up position, the 26 M does not which gives allot more floor space in the main cabin. The X has a shallower draft with either the board down or up by 3 inches compared to the M, but the M has a larger board over all. When up, the M's board does not bang about all night long. However, if you hit the bottom hard enough, the dagger board will be badly damaged. Believe me I know Because of the dagger board, deeper hull shape and rotating mast the M is faster than the X .

[Québec 1]

I bought a 2003 Mac cause The 2003-04 Macs seemed like the Macs with the most room. I am 5'10'' and prefer to sleep in the V berth where I find it to be very comfortable, although in my navy days I found the forward bunks in destroyers were the worst place to sleep...but then anyone will end up sleeping in the V berth of a destroyer in pounding seas at 30 knots when you've been 4 on 4 off for a week straight try to pseudo sink USN nuclear subs
Q1

p.s. Officially we pseudo sank most USN nuclear subs although I often thought they sank us first but didn't want to say
My old ship!

[NiceAft]

I purchased an 05 M in 04. I purchased new, because I did not want to chance getting the previous owner's headaches. As it were, I did have problems with the new boat, but the dealer stood by his promises. Everything was rectified

As for the V berth, the Admiral is 5'2", she finds it quite comfortable. I'm only 5'7", and I find it too small.

Quebec,
I thought you may be interested in seeing a picture of the destroyer my father spent a few years on in WWII. It was a flushdeck WWI destroyer. He was a chief in the boiler room, and would tell me stories of how the bulk heads would flex while in North Atlantic storms.

Click on image for a larger view

Ray

[School House Steve]

Here is the destroyer my dad served on in WII. He worked in a ship yard in Seattle helping build this and 4 other destroyers before enlisting in the Navy only to come back and be assigned to one of the ships he helped build. He worked in the Combat Information Center as a radar tech. They saw action in the Pacific at Iwo Jima and Okinawa until a Kamikaze plane blew a 40 foot hole in the side of their ship. No one was killed except for the pilot. He also told me about how the ship would twist and bend during storms.

[Québec 1]

I purchased an 05 M in 04. I purchased new, because I did not want to chance getting the previous owner's headaches. As it were, I did have problems with the new boat, but the dealer stood by his promises. Everything was rectified

As for the V berth, the Admiral is 5'2", she finds it quite comfortable. I'm only 5'7", and I find it too small.

Quebec,
I thought you may be interested in seeing a picture of the destroyer my father spent a few years on in WWII. It was a flushdeck WWI destroyer. He was a chief in the boiler room, and would tell me stories of how the bulk heads would flex while in North Atlantic storms.

Click on image for a larger view

Ray

Nice Aft,
Thnks for the pic ; here's a link to a 3 buck souvenir on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/-1938-NAVY-SHIP-CVR ... 9126004r72

This is her history, and she sure served her country well. A good ship to have in your family history.
http://www.fact-archive.com/encyclopedi ... edirect=no

Q1

[Québec 1]

Here is the destroyer my dad served on in WII. He worked in a ship yard in Seattle helping build this and 4 other destroyers before enlisting in the Navy only to come back and be assigned to one of the ships he helped build. He worked in the Combat Information Center as a radar tech. They saw action in the Pacific at Iwo Jima and Okinawa until a Kamikaze plane blew a 40 foot hole in the side of their ship. No one was killed except for the pilot. He also told me about how the ship would twist and bend during storms.

Steve,
Did a little research and found this paragraph which illustrates the incredible scene which has her crashed into by a kamikaze and back in service 10 days latter:

On the afternoon of 8 April, USS Gregory’s lookouts spotted three Japanese planes coming in out of the setting sun, a favorite kamikaze device. One of the suicide craft, pieces of fuselage spinning wildly off as Gregory’s guns registered hit after hit, crashed into the destroyer amidships just above the waterline to port. Gregory shuddered under the impact and began to slow in the water as power failed in her forward engine and fire rooms flooded. The two other kamikazes mercilessly pressed on their attack, but the wounded DD downed both of them in blazing gunfire. Gregory then steamed to the anchorage at Kerama Retto for temporary repairs, and on 19 April departed Okinawa. After escorting the aircraft carrier Intrepid (CV-11) to Pearl Harbor, she sailed for San Diego, reaching there 18 May for battle repairs. While Gregory was still in overhaul, the Japanese surrendered.

What an incredible story...you couldn't make up a story like that if you tried!

Q1

p.s. would make a great movie!

[Terry]

I bought a 2003 Mac cause The 2003-04 Macs seemed like the Macs with the most room. I am 5'10'' and prefer to sleep in the V berth where I find it to be very comfortable, although in my navy days I found the forward bunks in destroyers were the worst place to sleep...but then anyone will end up sleeping in the V berth of a destroyer in pounding seas at 30 knots when you've been 4 on 4 off for a week straight try to pseudo sink USN nuclear subs

You prefer the teeny eeny, itsy bitsy, miniature V-berth for midgets when you have that honkin big, huge, massive, gargantuan queen size aft berth???
Not to mention putting your weight in the V-berth causes excessive pendulum motion over the hull whereas putting your weight aft puts your weight in the flattest portion of the hull and the lowest portion of the hull thereby lowering the center of gravity and creating a more stable boat while at anchor and asleep. Go figure....

I purchased an 05 M in 04. I purchased new, because I did not want to chance getting the previous owner's headaches. As it were, I did have problems with the new boat, but the dealer stood by his promises. Everything was rectified

Well Ray,
I think I got headaches from not buying used. I got headaches after buying a brand new '03 and having to do all the upgrades myself. I'd rather someone else do them next time. The upside is that know every little thing about the upgrades because I did them.
Now I understand why some folks buy used.
As for the OP the daggerboard has less complications and less parts to break down, easier to repair. I still have my original DB even after a few light groundings. I also have the option of raising or lowering it to any length without moving lateral resistance fore or aft as is with the centerboard X.

[Hardcrab]

Do a tour of the X, the 03-04M, and 05-newer with the Admiral before buying.
She can decide which interior layout is best, being a big difference from each.

The other stuff may not matter as much to the Admiral.