High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

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delevi
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by delevi »

leon,whats the heaviest stuff that you have been out on? im thinking of doing a 130nm crossing next year,im going to beef up the keel first and the rudders.
Bastonjock,
You may consider DaveB's warning since he can speak of the :macx: and I'm certainly not qualified in that departmnet. My :macm: Does have the ballasted keel which is also much, much stronger than stock. I now use stock rudders, which are much stronger than IDA rudders. I also have 3 reefs in the mainsail, though that's been around for a short time. That said, I've had the :macm: out in approximately 40 knots. I recorded a gust in the mid-high 40s on a handheld gauge. This was in shelter waters i.e. San Francisco Bay, so you would get the heavy big, frequent chop but not much in terms of swells (excpet near the Golden Gate) The boat is difficult to sail in these conditions. It's a workout, probably not for newbies, and not for the timid, but it can be done, and I never felt like I was in serious danger. In the ocean, I've had her out in massive swells, mountainous swells (but I really don't know how to judge wave height i.e assign a number in feet, etc.) On a fairly recent trip, waves were breaking several miles offshore. I was heading out under power (planned to go 4-5 miles offshore) before hoisting sails. I managed to maneuver around most of them but ended up taking a couple breakers. Boat handled it without a problme. One was a bit scary as a huge wave was curling above me. Had to be higher than my spreaders, getting close to breaking. Hit the throttle all the way and somehow climbed to the top of it, slicing the crest just as it broke, turning around to see this massive white monster :o Took some small breakers on the beam while under sail... no problem (but sure wouldn't look for them.) Probably the biggest winds I've seen in open ocean on the mac were about 25 knots. I'm a bit concnerned how she would do in 35 with the seas that would ensue. I chartered 3 times so far. Jenneau 32, Bene35, Bene40. Every trip, there was at least one day of heavy stuff. 40 knots in Greece on the 32 footer, 25 knots in the Bahamas on the 40 footer, and 45+ in Sea of Cortez on the 35 footer. That one was the harriest becasue of the following seas. First and only time I had to bite down hard and keep myself from panicking. We were also out of booze :x :P

The biggest thing with seas in not so much the wave height but how close together the waves are, and whether the waves are breakers. Even huge waves are not a problem if their height is less than the seconds apart (i.e. seas 12 feet every 14 seconds) From what I read, most storms don't produce breaking waves. These are obviously the most dangerous and can capsize a boat if hit on the beam. An 8-10 foot breaking wave on the beam could capsize a Mac. Take it on the bow, however, and you'll probably be OK. Nice thing about the skinny Macs is that skinny boats are more difficult to capsize than fatter ones. The Mac's capsize ration is 1.9. Anything below 2.0 is considered very good, and ranks favorably, even vs. much larger keel boats. Nice web site here: http://image-ination.com/sailcalc.html

Disclaimer:
Don't try this at home. I'm not condoning anyone try anything dangerous. I'm not an expert. I'm not giving any sort of advice. Just sharing personal experience. Always ask your mother first. Must be 18 to qualify. Lawyers stay away.

LD :o TRIPPLE REEFED!
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bastonjock
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by bastonjock »

leon,im glad that you find the boat difficult to sail in heavy chop,square seas i call them :) the keel boaters tell me that the waves are harder to handle close in to shore so im thinking of trying a bit further out.

with refference to the 130nm,its a straight line from Norfolk Uk to Belgium,i can sail down the coast and close the gap to 20nm,its a much longer route but safer
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bubba
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by bubba »

Hay Mike you and Roger should take on sailing to Hawaii in an M NEXT

I really liked the photos and I can't waite for the movie.
mikelinmon
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by mikelinmon »

Roger posted the high wind dvd this pm on

macgregor26

MIke
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delevi
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by delevi »

Very nice Mike. You may have been a bit happier with the jib on the furler.. though looked like you were beam reaching so the partial genny wasn't much of a compromise. Those are some big waves. Next time, you'll need to get roger out on the 26 :D

Leon
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bubba
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by bubba »

Nice short film. Mike it would have been nice if you were using the roller reef main to see how it stood up to the breezes.
corkscrew
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by corkscrew »

Would something like a 34' /36' Hunter be suitable for sailing to Bermuda? What are the specs to be desired for some off shore sailing - Bermuda / Bahamas?
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tangentair
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by tangentair »

corkscrew
This is a pretty general list but a good place to start.
I am not a hunter fan, their sales people generally manage to offend me at Strictly Sail every year with their "used car" tactics, but any well outfitted deep keel boat would be my choice for offshore, I am not sure that the Bahama's is that offshore however, they are more coastal and I would, weather and time permitting, certainly take my Mac over. IMO It's shallow water capabilities far out weight the difficulty if any crossing the gulf stream.
Ron
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by corkscrew »

I am planning on being in the chesapeake 95% of the time, in any case I'd probably do a shoal draft if i ever upgraded. Just would be nice to have something that "could" handle a bermuda run if i was ever compentant enough to do it. Probably be on my Mac for a few years to come. What about tartans or c & c?
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Divecoz
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by Divecoz »

[quote="corkscrew"]I am planning on being in the Chesapeake 95% of the time, in any case I'd probably do a shoal draft if i ever upgraded. Just would be nice to have something that "could" handle a Bermuda run if i was ever competent enough to do it. Probably be on my Mac for a few years to come. What about tartans or c & c?[/quot

IMHO just look and read in the mags who has gone where on what......... Tartan, C&C, Island Packet, Swan, Oceana a host of others, All Big Money and All Big Water boats and all very different from one another, as well.
mikelinmon
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by mikelinmon »

Reflections on the high wind sail: My guess is; you are right about the heavy boat for te ocean crossings but mostly due to movement on our bodies. the waves we were in were 100 feet apart and though big big, they were passing under us, lifting and falling, scary only at first, then fun. Don't even want to know about big breaking waves. Have some racing experience in very high winds from the Gulf of Mexico summer thunderstorms and small 5 foot breakers. More later.
Mike Inmon
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bastonjock
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by bastonjock »

I been out a couple of times in choppy seas with 5-8ft breakers,i have not been out in big gently rolling seas.I was out with c130 king and that was hairy enough in a F6-7,pulling the anchor back on board was not for the feint hearted and re-entry into the harbour was fun also,if i had misjudged it we would have been smashed on a large navigation bouy,i had to turn into the wind and waves for a while and my biggest problem was vision,i could not see a lot as the salt water was hitting my face and burning my eyes.On the other occasion i was being lifted and twisted to 40-60 deg by the largest of the waves,i would then steer into the wave,if i had been hit twice in sucession with the 8ft breaking waves that were coming through i would have rolled it think,my big worry at the time was the steering i kept thinking if this goes im toast.
Mostof the waves were around 4-6ft with the bigger ones up to around 8ft.

The lesson that i learned from my second of the bumpy rides was to do a proper passage plan on paper charts as well as use your plotter,my plotter packed in about 1-2nm just before a place called orford ness,if i had checked the charts i would have notticed the warnings for "outfalls".I would do my best to avoid seas such as those in future.On the Orford experience i felt that i had taken the mac to its limit.
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c130king
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by c130king »

Matt,

Thank the stars for that great Yammy 50 4-stroke of yours. Never missed a beat in those very rough conditions. If the motor had failed while we were attempting to re-enter Wells Harbour it would not have been a good day.

Of course if it had then the boat would have rolled and we would have been tossed in the sea...but it would have rinsed all the puke off my ugly yellow foulies... 8)

Cheers,
Jim

P.S. And I don't know if my other Brit Buddy, RickJ, is still checking in but we had pretty impressive waves last Summer out there around the East side of the Isle of Wight with a pretty wicked Southerly wind kicking up 8-10 footers fairly close together. But we were motoring in the following sea...not sailing...until we got into the lee of the island on the North side.
Kelly Hanson East
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by Kelly Hanson East »

Addressing threads of the variety "Can Boat A do Crossing B??

Not trying to offend anyone, but these questions usually open a can of worms, or at least the Whatneys Red Barrel of Monkeys...

Cork - A Hunter 36 is a decent size boat and many smaller boats have made that trip, to answer the question.

However - the trip question is 90% crew and 10% boat. If I tried to take Rich's Pearson 36 to Hawaii, and my sailing buddy Captain Murdoch took my Island 17, I would bet on him over me....in a word, because of his seamanship.

I sailed with him around Berkeley once, in small J boats, sailing BACKWARDS, in perfect control...just like Chazz Palminteri in 'Bronx Tale'.....because he CAN...
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delevi
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Re: High wind movie, 35+ and 20' waves

Post by delevi »

I sailed with him around Berkeley once, in small J boats, sailing BACKWARDS, in perfect control...
I want to learn that trick. Sounds like a great guy to go sailing with. Stephen, you gotta hook me up. I'll buy the beer. 8)
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