MAC 23/24 mast?

[flyermonkey]

Hey everyone. I need the help of somebody who knows a lot more about MacGregor's than I do. I have come across a nice 1971, 24 in pretty decent shape. Has a trailer and lots of extras. And its extremely extremely cheap ($250). The only thing it is missing is the mast, as it was damaged beyond repair. I know a new mast = $$$$ but I know where I can get a MAC 23 mast for $350. Is the mast from a MAC23 the same or compatible with a MAC 24? Thanks in advance!

[heinzir]

I would ask your question on the Venture 24 specific forum:
www.groups.yahoo.com/group/venture24

Lots of great information about these classic good old boats.

Henry

[flyermonkey]

Thanks. I think I'll give them a try. Love that 23 you have btw.

[Catigale]

Good luck on that quest, but please understand that the 'cheap boat missing the X' scenario plays out every day in the marine world, invariably ending up with not-so-cheap boat.

Adapting slight changes of rigging can be awfully expensive due the cascading need for mods....

One last word of advice...don't think for a minute that a boat built of pieces as an investment...it will not carry the book value of the standard rigged boat...typically 1/3 that value or less.

You can buy a decent Sail ready Venture 23 for 3000 USD pretty much on demand , with 600 bucks in hull and mast you have another 400 or so to breakeven point.

[flyermonkey]

Good luck on that quest, but please understand that the 'cheap boat missing the X' scenario plays out every day in the marine world, invariably ending up with not-so-cheap boat.

Adapting slight changes of rigging can be awfully expensive due the cascading need for mods....

One last word of advice...don't think for a minute that a boat built of pieces as an investment...it will not carry the book value of the standard rigged boat...typically 1/3 that value or less.

You can buy a decent Sail ready Venture 23 for 3000 USD pretty much on demand , with 600 bucks in hull and mast you have another 400 or so to breakeven point.

Thanks! I'm defnatly not set on buying the boat i posted about. Just considering it as an option. Like you said good chance it isn't worth the work/$. I know what you meen about the it not being an investment. Seen that assumtion go wrong. Just looking at inexpensive but still fun sailling options to get me back on the water

[mastreb]

Ditto everything Catigale said. Better off paying twice as much for a dirty and poorly maintained but complete boat.

[Catigale]

Of course, opinions being like fissures, Dave is in the process of proving me wrong over on the Venture Board with is Bucaneer 7 saga....

[81venture]

Of course, opinions being like fissures, Dave is in the process of proving me wrong over on the Venture Board with is Bucaneer 7 saga....

Catigale is right! It all depends on the Damage to the project boat and your pocketbook....Costs quickly skyrocket with the "little things"

I have restored many an old money pit in the powerboat world...you never get your $$ back (even when it's antique/classic like restored)

That being said look at my post in the venture board....I bought a Hoopty for only $400...it's sitting on a NICE dual axle trailer worth roughly $1k, and I stripped off over $600+ of gear (pulpit, life lines, stanchions, rear rail, electronics, and other goodies) all to upgrade my Venture23

So my advice to you is if the boat is only $250 you might go ahead and grab it anyway....strip the gear you want for your future boat, clean it up and do a "Donald Trump" to it
(Break it apart and sell the pieces for more than the whole was worth like he does to companies )

A sail Trailer in decent shape down here in NC will fetch $500 easy

Dave

[81venture]

Also when I was looking at Sailboats initially I found MANY a good deal on a nice 23- 25 ft Trailer Sailboat....I mean some GOOD deals

But I had to pass because they had no trailers

I'd buy it for $250 (see if he'll take $200 with a sob story about how much a new mast is)

Dave

[gedaggett]

I assume that the mast for the 23 may be shorter than the 24. If this is the case you will be shortening your rigging. If the rigging is in good shape it may not be as expensive as you can cut and swage on new fixed ends keeping the turnbuckles the same. However the extra foot of length may mean that this is only the case with the side stays and the forestay and back stay may need to be longer. I can tell you that I replaced the forestay on my boat last year and it will cost you about $50-$65 dollars. The other cost consideration are the sails. The best scenario would be to get the sails with the 23 foot mast so you know the main and jibs match but if you need to get another main to match you area talking a significant amount of money. If you look at the expense of this job in conservative estimates this is what might look look like (worst case) Boat $250, Mast $350, New stays $200-$250, Main sail $200-$500. This would put you in the $1000-$1350 range. I have seen plenty of venture 22-24's on craigslist for around that price without the hassle. Just a thought.

Example:http://racine.craigslist.org/boa/3218859060.html $1500 asking price on a trailer

[heinzir]

BWYachts.com shows the V24 as using a 28' x 3" x 4" extrusion. This is the same mast as the one on my Venture 23 and is also used on the V25. You will not have any problem adapting this mast. The boom on the V24, I believe, is longer than that on other Ventures at 10' or 11'. You should not use the sails from the V23 on the 24 for several reasons:

1) The V23 is a cutter rig using two head sails instead of one. Neither the jib nor the staysail is as large as the jib on a sloop. The combined sail area of both is larger than the jib of a comparable sloop but individually they are pretty small.
2) The boom on the 24 is much longer than the 23 so the mainsail will be too small.
3) The mast on the 23 is set with an extreme amount of rake in keeping with the 1890s Pilot Cutter theme. That amount of rake would look ridiculous on the 24, and using a sail cut for a conventional more or less vertical mast would cause the end of the boom to droop into the cockpit.
4) The cutter rigged V23 has a bowsprit to support the outer forestay and jib; the sloop rigged V24 would only be able to use the staysail as a jib.

The rigging is easy to replace if you do the work yourself, but if you want to save $$ you might have to wait until you find the best deal on ebay or craigslist. But if the boat hull and deck are solid (no rot in the deck core), $250 is still quite a deal. I might even buy the trailer from you for $500 if it has brakes!!!

Getting and restoring this boat might make economic sense or it might not. Only you can decide if it is worth the time and money it may require. If you just like working on boats in general and plan on keeping it for a long time I'd say go for it. If you are in a hurry to get out on the water or planning on "moving up" soon then this boat might not be for you.

Regarding price, I just sold an old 8' fiberglass "Sinbad the Sailer" sailing dinghy on craigslist for $800 and then bought an 11' wooden Mirror dinghy in perfect shape with sails, trailer, and cover for $850. A real classic!


I've also been noticing on some other forums that people are buying older sailboats and using them as power boats. This is done primarily by us older folks for whom the athletics required on a sailboat are getting to be too much. They make good little camp cruisers as sailboats generally have more cabin space and better accommodations than a power boat of equal size and are easily powered to displacement speed by very small motors. I have read of several people that have converted sailboats to power boats in order to do the great circle route (down the Mississippi and around the eastern half of the US.) Sailboats can make the trek but generally have to have their masts down because of the many low bridges. Just a thought.

[Catigale]

...we have seen the same trend cruising the Erie canal here in NY...

Speed limit is 10 mph, so your twin 454 Super Cobra Jet Belchfires are going to be on idle all the way to Buffalo, while you shuffle the deck of cards..

A Mac with a small 15 HP or 9.9 is going to be close to the same speed on that venue..

[heinzir]

Here is a site that has the sail dimensions of the various Venture/Macgregor boats. It can help to determine which sails can be exchanged with which boats: http://www.wadler.org/boat-mac/sailsXboat.php

You can use smaller sails than called for but be careful if going bigger. You might run out of forestay, mast, or boom before you run out of sail.

Henry