Secure Rotating Mast

[Johnacuda]

Yes, it seems that the real issue for sailboats is the POSITION of the ballast, not what the ballast is or how much. Even a little bit of ballast way down low can make a boat stiffen up pretty fast, but trailer boats like the MAC and the Aquarius, and the Hunter that carry all their ballast up high are not going to get that instant response, the ballast is so high up it takes a lot of heel angle before you feel anything pushing back. I have often wondered what even a little bit of lead, like 100 pounds, in the end of the daggerboard would do.

Someday I might buy a spare daggerboard and take the one i have already that is pretty banged up and fill the bottom of it with lead just to see how the boat sails with that.

I think it could make a SIGNIFICANT difference. (Could break off the daggerboard too?)

It would be quite a mod.

I am certain I read a thread/mod where someone filled their daggerboard with lead shot and epoxy. I am assuming the dagger board would need to be down to get any benefit from the weight.

[BOAT]

Yeah, that's the thing I'm driving at - a way to get some weight way down there like 5 feet from the bottom of the boat where it can really do some good and really stiffen things up because of the leverage - would 100 pounds be enough to do it??

Where are those engineer guys? There must be some sort of formula that would tell how much push you get up topside by adding 100 pounds of push 5 feet down below?? Would it make a big difference??

[Highlander]

I'd say if ur mast is swinging around that easy ur shrouds are way too loose !!! I'd start from there first
I have drilled a hole in the bottom plate of the mast base swivel plate so as I can use a 1/4" hitch pin through the hole where the vang goes & lock the mast for when trling

J

[BOAT]

I have drilled a hole in the bottom plate of the mast base swivel plate so as I can use a 1/4" hitch pin through the hole where the vang goes & lock the mast

I like it. Simple, easy to remember.

[Ixneigh]

Re mast rotation stop: I ran a line from the base of the vang where it shackles to the mast plate, to a small block on the stancion base, and then back to a jamcleat screwed into the deck opposite the winch. The line runs along the little rail on the side of the deck and is not much of a clutter hazard. I can lock the rotation by yanking that line tight, or release it. It stays locked whenever the main is down. The mast slams when powering through waves, wakes or occasionally at anchor. Wakes were a big issue. Your at anchor peacefully and a big boat goes by, you boat rocks and the mast slams without a rotation lock. I do not like the pin solution. You have to go up to put it in.
Re ballasted board: This has been talked about somewhere before. My feeling is, at least 200 pounds to make much of a difference. You would have to make a new board from scratch. I feel a wood BD with 200 LBS of lead would be strong and fairly cheap. also, now you will need a mechanical advantage to raise it.
Re vangs: I hardly use mine except on a reach.
Re topping lifts: This makes reefing A LOT easier. I wouldnt want to be without one.
Re boom storage: Although I do have a topping lift, I lay the boom end on deck between the winch and the stancion, and pull the mainsheet in tight, locking it in place. I place a towel or cushion underneath to protect the deck. I get eye rolls from the other sailors but this system keeps the movement of the boom to zero. Otherwise, it swings from the topping lift. It moves, no matter how much you tighten the mainsheet. Note my boat is kept on a mooring. At a nice calm dock, things like this are a non-issue. I do not like to have stuff banging, swinging or bouncing in bad weather.
Re roaming at anchor: Most shoaldraft boats will do this. High freeboard makes it worse. Furlers and other tophamper makes it even worse. My boat roams more then an intact male dog. I just learned to live with it. Its sort of like being underway, all the time
Re real name: NEVAR HAHAHAHAHA
Ix

[Tomfoolery]

I get eye rolls from the other sailors but this system keeps the movement of the boom to zero. Otherwise, it swings from the topping lift. It moves, no matter how much you tighten the mainsheet. Note my boat is kept on a mooring. At a nice calm dock, things like this are a non-issue. I do not like to have stuff banging, swinging or bouncing in bad weather.

To keep my boom in place, I move the mainsheet to one side of the cockpit, clipped to the little eye strap that helps support the dodger wing, and I made a short length of 3-strand with an eye splice on each end with boat snaps, and just clip that to the eye strap on the other side and to the bail on the boom. Makes an inverted Y, with the topping lift being the stem, and there's no movement of the boom. It's held just above the bimini, which is above head height.

If I have the bridge in place (between the bimini and the dodger), then I can't do that, and I just clip the main sheet block to the lifeline rail and snug it. It will bang around a bit there, as there's no 'third leg' to stabilize it, but that's the way it goes.

[RobertB]

Since I use a snap shackle to attach my sheet block to the traveler. When at dockside, I just disconnect from the traveler and clip the sheet block to the far lifeline.

[Russ]

Someday I might buy a spare daggerboard and take the one i have already that is pretty banged up and fill the bottom of it with lead just to see how the boat sails with that.

I think it could make a SIGNIFICANT difference. (Could break off the daggerboard too?)

It would be quite a mod.

This has been done by several board members. One was "professionally" done by IDA Sailor (now http://www.ruddercraft.com) for Leon's boat. It's a big job apparently. The dagger is thin so it needs reinforcement. Dropping lead into it will cause the bottom to bow out so it takes some engineering to keep it together. Then there is the added lift required to raise it.
As I recall it made some significant improvement in performance, but not necessarily worth the expense and effort.

Another thread on weighted dagger
http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... ger#p95787
http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... ger#p45526

[BOAT]

Since I use a snap shackle to attach my sheet block to the traveler. When at dockside, I just disconnect from the traveler and clip the sheet block to the far lifeline.

Hmmmm . . I would not use my snap shackle under sail - I do indeed have one (you can see it in the picture below that I capped from another "Muscle Head" video:



But my snap shackle is just hanging there because snap shackles are only rated to 300 pounds. To make attachment to the bale I use a screw link rated for 3500 pounds, the shackle is just hanging there so I can hook the bale to other stuff too when I'm not sailing. (You know, like lifelines, or even the main-block when docked or it makes a nifty hook for lowering stuff overboard with the boom like stowaways).

This vid cap came from another vid of 'boat' bending the top of the mainsail with the traveler like a 'muscle head' only in this vid it's a port tack instead - the traveler works really good and it can be done even when not pointing real high as in this vid - light winds:

http://s1325.photobucket.com/user/boat2 ... e.mp4.html

Forces on the bale can exceed 600 pounds - not sure U would use a snap shackle there guys, but that's just me.

[Tomfoolery]

But my snap shackle is just hanging there because snap shackles are only rated to 300 pounds.

A quick peruse through WM's catalog shows fixed-eye snap shackles rated up to 7700 lb safe (or max) working load (SWL or MWL). There are some itty-bitty ones rated as low as 363 lb SWL, but they're too small to be used on a main sheet, IMO.

I don't trust them completely, and use an anchor shackle to secure the lower block of the MRS to the deck eye strap, for instance, but I'm ok with using them for the main sheet.

[RobertB]

Hmmmm . . I would not use my snap shackle under sail - I do indeed have one (you can see it in the picture below that I capped from another "Muscle Head" video:

But my snap shackle is just hanging there because snap shackles are only rated to 300 pounds. To make attachment to the bale I use a screw link rated for 3500 pounds, the shackle is just hanging there so I can hook the bale to other stuff too when I'm not sailing. (You know, like lifelines, or even the main-block when docked or it makes a nifty hook for lowering stuff overboard with the boom like stowaways).

Forces on the bale can exceed 600 pounds - not sure U would use a snap shackle there guys, but that's just me.

I knew this would come up - I suggest you consider using snap shackles from a reputable marine supply instead of whatever is only rated for 300 pounds.

I use very inexpensive Ronstan bronze snap shackles - rated at 1400 pounds Many available for working loads over 2000 pounds. This is perfectly adequate for a main sheet considering it exceeds the rated capacity of the line used for the sheet. I also use these for my mast raising system and the vang. If you have a , I bet you have snap shackles for lifelines too.

[BOAT]

If you have a , I bet you have snap shackles for lifelines too.

Okay, that comment tells me where I'm getting tripped up, I must have the words all wrong - I call the thingies on my lifelines PELICAN Hooks, I never ever thought of them as SNAP shackles. Yeah, you guys are right - a regular DOUBLE OPEN EYE SNAP Shackle like the one I sent in the picture is not gonna take 800 pounds - because the eyes are OPEN, they will bend. That is why I said I will NOT use my "SNAP SHACKLE" to sail the boat. And I don't.

Sorry, I thought a SNAP Shackle is something with an open eye - I never thought to call a closed eye shackle like a pelican hook a SNAP shackle. I always though to be a snap shackle it had to be something with an open eye that you just "snap" right onto something else, not pull a pin to release a plunger to open. And a DOUBLE open eye SNAP shackle over 300 pounds??? I dunno, maybe, but I doubt it. (I sure would not want to test it).

Yeah, from my way of thinking there isn't a snap eye shackle on the entire boat that came from the factory. I guess I must be using the wrong words. What kind of Ronstan Double Eye SNAP shackle can take 2000 pounds?? Where can i get one? that might be handy if it really is a double.

[Crikey]

A slight twist on this thread.... Has anyone tried rotating the mast further when powered under sail? Could that provide any enhancement of the leading edge curve, or a better overall airfoil shape? I realize it would probably take quite a bit of force to overcome the pull of the mainsail but something that could be managed with a couple of small blocks. Tell tales would show what was going on.
Might give this a whirl shortly.

[Tomfoolery]

What kind of Ronstan Double Eye SNAP shackle can take 2000 pounds??

2200 lb SWL, 4400 lb breaking strength.

http://www.ronstan.com/marine/product.asp?ProdNo=RF6100

And here are some good for up to 15,000 lb SWL with 30,000 lb breaking strength, though a different style.

http://www.apsltd.com/c-775-triggerrele ... trops.aspx

Where can i get one? that might be handy if it really is a double.

The Ronstan is $36 at WM. Heavier ones are available.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... sNum=50047

[BOAT]

The Ronstan is $36 at WM. Heavier ones are available.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... sNum=50047

That eye can't bend open because it's captured at both ends. I'm totally screwed up - I thought we were talking about something else - my mistake.
Yeah, I see where I'm going wrong - I thought that was a PELICAN HOOK, like I said you guys are totally right - I'm screwed up on the names of this stuff, I got it all wrong - I thought those were PELICAN HOOKS - I did not know those were called snap shackles. I thought a snap shackle had an open eye. You can see in the picture I sent on my post that the thingy I have is an open eye shackle (it's a double - open eyes at both ends). I would be afraid to use that for the boom bale. BWY also sends bronze OPEN EYE snap (shackle, hook, what do I call it?) on their topping lift kit that I would not trust past 200 pounds. I'm using the wrong words and I am in error about what a SNAP shackle is.

So do they make that with two eyes, a DOUBLE, that's what would really be handy to me. A DOUBLE snap shackle that can handle 2000 pounds?