Crazy idea for backup motor

[Russ]

I have had a Suzuki 2.5 outboard for my dinghy in my garage for 5 years. It has no gas in it and it's a 4-stroke, so it does have oil.

I don't want to mount the thing on my transom because it would be in the way.
My idea is to install a motor mount and store the motor below deck someplace for emergency propulsion. In a pinch, it would get me home.
The motor, when attached to the dinghy, was able to push my boat nicely at about 5mph.

Stupid idea? My fear is there might still be gasoline vapors leaking out, even though it's empty. Suzuki says it can be stored on it's side, if you lay it on the correct side.

[Stickinthemud57]

My immediate thought is whether the shaft length will be sufficient to get the prop into the water. Depends on your mount I suppose.

I used a 3.3-horse four-stroke to get from the ramp to my slip once (about 500 yards). It got me there, but it was dicey, especially when turning. Good thing it was a calm day.

I think anything that had gas in it is going to produce a gas odor. The question is how much. You will, of course, have to keep some gas on the boat.

It could work in calmer weather, I suppose.

[Be Free]

If it's empty and stored correctly it will probably be fine in the cabin (until it's not). I've been known to stow my small generator at the bottom of the ladder in bad weather and I've never had a spill or explosion. That doesn't mean you won't be reading about me in the papers at some point in the future.

Personally, I would not keep gasoline or a gasoline powered engine in the cabin as a matter of course. I also would not carry a small outboard as a backup. I carry a good anchor and a towing policy for when the engine won't start and the wind won't blow.

Regardless of what advice you get on this thread, I would point you to the words of H.L. Mencken, "For every complex question, there is an answer that is simple, elegant, and wrong."

[rsvpasap]

I have a 2002 26X. I sometimes run all of the gasoline out of my Honda EU 2200i generator and store it in the cargo area (aka "aft berth").

I have a Newport NT300 outboard for the dingy. I always hang it in the head. I installed a dowel across the top of the head enclosure and just hang the outboard from a short piece of bungee cord. The outboard has to be removed when someone needs to use the head. The NT 300 is 24 lbs and about the same size as the Suzuki 2.5.

[beechkingd]

If you drained it and ran the carb dry the vapor left would not be an issue.

[Russ]

I may research what kind of motor mounts would work. The rudders are kind of in the way of everything.

I'm really thinking this might be a good idea to have a backup. Yesterday, we were motoring when the motor stopped suddenly. Turned out to be the fuel line somehow disconnected from the motor. Easy fix, but reinforced my fear of the need for a backup.

[OverEasy]

Hi Russ!

This reminds me of Wiley Coyote with a lighter in the dark explosive shed to see where he is… click…click…BOOM!
Funny in cartoons, not in real life.

I don’t expect many have gotten to see a gasoline vapor explosion up close and personal but it doesn’t take much fuel to make it happen.
Just a little bit of fuel, a bit of warmth for evaporation, a mildly restricted volume space and an ignition source as minimal as a static charge… to make things rather energetically attention gathering.

I’d love to give some examples but here is not the time or place. Suffice to say that even a little fuel (like gasoline) can go a long way to make a really unpleasant day.

One issue with fuel vapors is they sneak up on you… you gradually get used to them as they gradually build within a restricted area. That area does not need to be confined, just somewhat restricted or somewhat still in even an open environment.
While an engine may have been run ‘dry’ there are still fuel wetted surfaces within the fuel tank and lines.
There is also the aspect of where the tank is still partially filled when one stops using it…now what does one do?

Our boats are plastic and can generate static just by moving around in/on them… they are not conductive and can/do generate static charge just being there, never mind if traveling down the highway or sitting in a slip. There are also electrical systems such as batteries and wires hidden in/under/behind the limited (still air) spaces/voids/bilge of fiberglass panels that could potentially be compromised which could provide an ignition source. The same goes for turning on a switch or breaker or light bulb socket for that matter. Then there is always flame based cook tops, lanterns and candles…. Or a simple use of a lighter (for those that still smoke).

Gasoline vapors tend to be slightly heavier than air so they sink or stratify to the lowest levels available and build upwards (part of the reason people may have not ‘smelled’ the fuel vapors… and thinking they ‘don’t have an issue storing gasoline inside their cabin spaces such as the aft berth or head compartment or lockers. Reliance upon luck is not a good tactic in life generally and with boat even less so where others are involved.

Really just is not worth it… Any Amount of Fuel should be kept outside in a well ventilated area.
Because one may have “gotten away with it” in the past isn’t a valid excuse….

Please keep all gasoline and fuels in a well ventilated area.
Please.

It’s just not worth it….

Best Regards,
Over Easy

[OverEasy]

Hi Russ

Here’s an idea….
https://patents.google.com/patent/US20090098783A1/en

Best Regards,
Over Easy

[Russ]

My 2.5 hasn't had fuel in it for over 5 years. Sitting in my garage dry as a bone.
The fuel vapor on boats and in the cabin thing is my biggest concern. I would make sure it's perfectly dry before ever bringing it down below.

Yes, gasoline vapors go boom and it's not pretty.

[rsvpasap]

Just going to come back and reiterate or restate something I said earlier on this thread.

There are folks who have internal gasoline tanks in their 26x, including one or more moderators of this forum. I assume they all have ignition protected bilge blowers. Probably they also installed a gasoline fume detector. You could also put a fan in a window.


You might like to consider these options should you decide to store a gasoline device in the cabin.

If anyone has examples of boats that have caught on fire due to storing an outboard motor or a generator that has an empty gas tank inside the cabin, I would really appreciate seeing links to that reporting. Obviously, gasoline fires are the most common catastrophic problem on boats and we all carry gasoline on our Macgregors in tanks that are two feet away from the open companionway. Are there any reported examples of explosions inside the cabin of the boat from portable generators or outboards that have empty fuel tanks? I'm unable to find any. Please point them out.

Nonetheless, I use a Newport NT300 as my dingy motor and as my final propulsion backup for the 26x. It will move the boat fully loaded boat at about three knots in flat conditions. When its not on the dingy, I keep it hanging on a short rope from a dowel in the head.

Using a small electric motor like the NT300 vitiates the issue of gasoline in the cabin. It requires almost a no maintenance. It's more reliable than a gasoline outboard. It is essentially silent, or very close to it. It smells better and stays cleaner. It does require a 36 volt battery.

Another electric option is the epropulsion spirit 1.0 plus. It is a bit more expensive but has the battery and motor as a single integrated unit. I actually prefer having the battery as a separate units in the style of the nt300, in part I use this primarily for my dingy where I've installed two 50 amp 36 volt batteries, giving me a range of 15 to 20 miles at 4 to 5 knots.

I assume you all have boom preventers on your boat? There's something that's incredibly dangerous, especially for solo sailing.

[Russ]

The "crazy" part of my idea is that it IS a gasoline powered engine and gasoline below decks is dangerous.

The motor is dry as a bone and has been for 5 years. I suppose there could be some fumes in it.
I wouldn't fuel it up until deploying it. So it would be dry while inside the boat.

And I would ONLY deploy it in an emergency. I haven't used the dinghy or motor in a while.

[Stickinthemud57]

Up to this point I have seen the need to store gas in the cockpit as the stumbling block to this approach, but then it dawned on me that unless the failure is due to running out of gas, you already have gas on board. In this case the notion of storing a "bone dry" outboard in the cabin is not so crazy after all.

[adudinsk]

For a backup motor, what about an electric trolling motor.. hanging off the bow?
(Emergency Use only!)


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[OverEasy]

Hi Russ!

A lot of small dingy outboards have an integral fuel tank …. Is this the case for your engine?

If so, Here’s an idea I’ve seen done…
The idea is to put a “Y-valve” to allow one to selectively choose between the engine tank or to allow for the use of the boat’s main fuel supply tanks. The main tank connection line addition is a self sealing Quick Disconnect.
While in most instances this is for the convenience of not having to attempt pouring fuel into a smaller tank while on the water it also eliminates a partially filled small tank needing to be drained after use.

Just an idea…..

Best Regards,
Over Easy

[Russ]

It's a Suzuki 2.5 outboard. Has the fuel tank on top. I doubt it has an option beyond that. It's a dinghy motor. It does have a transmission for forward/neutral and reverse (Doesn't require turning 180 to reverse). Nice motor and lightweight. Matches my Suzuki 70.

When on the inflatable dinghy, it did manage to push the boat along nicely at around 5mph in calm conditions.

The tank is bone dry. Been sitting in the garage for 5 years. I probably should have fogged it.