Rounding up (weather helm)

[delevi]

Absolutely true, wouldn't heel so far, so little chance of rounding up. Also wouldn't go as fast either!

Either way works, as long as you're just using one sail. With both sails, even reefed, she just wants to round when hit with a quartering wave. I prefer the main for two reasons: 1. It's easier to furl in the jib vs. dropping the main, and unfurl it when conditions warrant. 2. The boat wants to round on a broad reach in quartering waves because it's tripping over the keel (pull it up) and the bow digs into a wave while another wave simultaneously pushes the stern off the wind. With the drive coming further aft (mainsail) the problem is aleviated. I think the bow may also ride a bit higher without the jib. Beene & I sailed with a single-reefed main & no jib in 30-35 kts and big waves and kept her on her feet. Speeds between 9-12 mph. Surfing & planing at times.

Leon

[live2shift]

I was out on Monday with small craft warnings off Marblehead, and all went pretty well until the gusts hit around 25 Kts, I had out the full main and Jib and she would round up so hard I could only stop it by letting the mainsheet out, or run with the main really far out and partially luffing. I didn't have the main reefed because mostly the wind was only 10-15 kts and she was sailing too slow. I need to come up with an option for going out with varying winds. Reefing the main is not something I want to do and undo several times on a sail.

If I had a roller furling would a reefed main and a partially rolled in Jib be a good setup that would reduce the rounding up/weather helm? I would rather furl and unfurl a jib instead of having to reef and un-reef the main!

What is a good setup for stiff winds on an "M"? thanks jeff

[delevi]

Jeff,

Furling the jib is a great option. I do this frequently... much easier than reefing the main and the boat actually sails better. I can run a full main and partial jib to 20-25 kts, though at 25, it's a lot of work, so if it looks like the winds aren't letting up, I'll take in a reef on the main. The full main should be really flattened to the max, however. Keep in mind that a stock setup will have a lower wind range prior to reefing. My setup is heavily modified, so maybe not the best example for most.

Leon

[live2shift]

So Leon what do you do when it is a major blow with gusts over 20-25? Do you run with a reefed main and partially furled jib? It seems like running with a reefed main alone is not very good. What have you found makes a decently balanced rig in big wind conditions?

Also, how do you flatten your sails? Jeff

[NiceAft]

I'm finding this thread very interesting ( I'm starting to sound like a Laugh In routine).

On Monday I tried to gull wing the main and the Genoa the whole 15 miles up the Delaware to our marina. It was going well ( sometimes sloppy looking), but a few times the boat took a 90 degrees turn I mean fast, and sudden! The boat heeled, and we took it in stride, but I would rather have just kept a nice sail up the river.

Ray

[Kelly Hanson East]

Ray - Im guessing what was happening to you is you proceeding fine under your apparent wind of X knots true wind minus your boat speed...

then you let your boat come a little off the wind and all of a sudden the apparent wind shoots up because your boat speed no longer is being subtracted from the true wind...the stronger wind now powers up your boat and the more it turns you into the wind the stronger the turning force and VOILA!! you round up.

The cure is to let out a big sigh, like AHOY VEY!

and proceed back on course.

[delevi]

Jeff,

I always have some jib out, even if it's beach towel size. The only exception to that is when broad reaching or running in big wind and following seas, which I covered in several other posts. In that scenario, I run under main alone to keep the boat from broaching. When it's blowing hard, I reef the main and use anywhere from 100% to 20% of the jib, depending on wind, point of sail, sea conditions, etc. Nice thing about a furler is you can quickly adjust the headsail size as needed. It makes a huge difference. Also, it makes a huge difference in balancing the boat as you pointed out. Even if it's a tiny amount of sail... it probably isn't doint much to power the boat on its own, but the added balance helps the main do its job much better. I recall sailing in 25-30 knots with double reefed main and no jib, trying to plow through the waves. Only managed speeds of 3.5 mph. Then I rolled out just a tiny bit of jib and gained 2 mph.

On edit: forgot to address the flattening of the mainsail. My sail is equipped with an 8:1 outhaul, led to the cockpit. I also have a cunningham. This is overkill for the stock sails, but quite handy on the loose-footed Quantum Fusion X sails I have. On the stock sail, you can winch the halyard a bit to flatten the top part. Crank down the outhaul as much as you can to flatten the rest. If you plan to be in high winds with any regularity, you might consider modifying your outhaul setup to a 4:1. A single line reefing setup is also a good idea.

Leon

[Boblee]

Even under engine power in rough seas I have a bit of jib out to dampen the wallow, especially when the big stink boats try to swamp you.

[Kelly Hanson East]

If you plan to be in high winds with any regularity, you might consider modifying your outhaul setup to a 4:1

This is a 1 minute, 20 USD mod. Put a small block on the eye on the end of the boom, then run the outhaul line from the cleat through the block and back again through the sail clew grommet. You might need a bit longer outhaul line than stock - okay - that makes it a 2 minute mod.

[opie]

I may have missed it, but be SURE to use a preventor when going wing & wing downwind, and raise the centerboard all the way. We do it whenever we can for the photo-op, sure, but also because I think it is a sailing skill that is enjoyable. The preventor is necessary or the main may kill you.....