Tow weight of 26M heavily laden for remote area cruise

[Boblee]

Yeah seen a few torsion bar trailer setups ,ie sitting beside the road waiting for spares if they can locate them and get them shipped to where they are, we were halfway up cape york and were able to get a new spring made to suit my camper trailer and shipped to me from Atherton springworks 6-800k's away within 24 hr's just took the measurments and sat back enjoying a beer and a bit of pig hunting.
If the trailer is made elsewhere be prepared to replace whole system, unless an aussie agent has a good stock, a leaf spring can be obtained anywhere easily, irrespective of where made originally.
Spoke to a bloke at Karajini Nat Park West Aus who had broken his Ubeaut sugar glider suspension on the rough roads he was not a good advertisement for them but invariably it is a minimum two weeks wait IF you can get bits although Alco are doing more now with the booming camper trailer market but we travelled round oz the equiv of at least twice over the very worst roads in the country with only one broken spring and no internal damage and the spring was totally my fault.
The original trailer springs, bushes and shackles failed in very short order due to them being too short and stiff but the new ones with greasable shackles rated at 2.4 tonne are brilliant and obtained within days.

[Relackson]

Hi Oskar

Thanks for your comprehensive information on weight. I've recently been through the weight hassle re insurance and legality. Not easy - and not a good result -> I load just about everything into my Rodeo ute to leave the boat as bare as possible. Still comes in at 1900 kgs, pretty much on the knocker.

I'm interested in your acquisition of a Ventura aluminium trailer. Where did you get it? What model did you get? Any other information would be appreciated.

Happy sailing

Stan

[Boblee]

Stan
When you say your boat and trailer comes in at 1900kg is that just the boat on the weighbridge or is it still attached to the tow vehicle ie weight minus ball weight?
Bob

[raycarlson]

bobb if you really knew how the torsion setup worked you wouldnt be making those statments,as there are so few moving parts to break,and whhat there is would be simple to fabricate,if there;s someone out there in the desert that can make a leaf spring then he could fab up any part needed on a torsion system. Crocodile Dundee could probably even figure it out.

[Boblee]

Ray you could well be right if Mick Dundee could do all he did in those movies fixing any axle would be no problems
Because I built a few trailers to go to places where not many go or want to go I do have a keen interest in different suspensions but after much research mainly anecdotal from people who should know because they make trailers or have to fix or redesign them where they break, for our conditions leaf springs are what I kept coming back to but if you never go off the bitumen or carry heavy loads some of the others are better and are even better providing they can be fixed or are driven accordingly.
Where I broke down in the example I mentioned the only person going to fix it was me with a replacement part and only with the tools I carried anything else meant trucking the trailer out or waiting for a part that could be fitted, it was in the middle of a stretch of road that proudly displays a sign 850k's of currugations to bitumen and believe me they are real corrugations with no relief by dropping one wheel off the edge there is one section of old track that is easier on suspension but it is all 4wd especially the rocky creek crossings.
Even the roads that we have taken the over like the Tablelands Hwy in the NT is almost 500k's of badly maintained car width bitumen and big potholes with only one park near one end (no service) and massive roadtrains that you either head bush or get wiped out, if you break down you can expect no help that will not cost you an arm and a leg and no communications except satelite phone or hf radio and irregular delivery of anything.
All that being said I personally do not feel threatened anywhere when travelling on land or water with well maintained and prepared vehicles and travelling at appropriate speeds to suit the conditions but there is a lot of money made from those who don't take care or listen to the wrong advice.

[Relackson]

Boblee

The trailer was detached from the vehicle, and weighed in at 1900 kgs with as much out as I could get.
Vehicle with trailer and boat attached weighed 2460 kgs.
Vehicle without trailer attached weighed 2180 kgs.
Therefore, the ball weight was 280 kgs.

Hope this helps.

Would love to get a 2500 kgs trailer!

Stan

[Oskar 26M]

Relackson:
Hi Stan
Sorry for the delay in replying regarding the Venture trailer.
I bought mine from Ventura WA, who import them direct from Venture USA, then modify them to conform to West Aus regulations. I don't know if anyone imports them to Victoria, but you could email Venture USA to find out. They are very responsive and helpful.
Below is some information about the dimensions of the trailer I bought. I'm not sure what model number it is but it was certified in WA to carry 3.2 tonnes. It has 4 wheel Tie Down ventilated disk brakes (stainless is now available) and an electric-hydraulic actuator(manufactured in Aus from US parts) which is controlled by my existing in-car Tekshona control unit. I my trailer also has the (optional) 1 metre towbar extension compared to the standard model. It makes launching and retrieval easier, but does make it a bit more difficult to navigate road roundabouts

The trailer I have would conform to Victorian and Qld's regulations and probably also NSW, but I found the info about NSW regulations confusing - the explanatory notes differ from the Gazetted Towing Regulation Exemption for Trailable Yachts. It could be that the Mac mast might have to be moved forward about 0.3 m if the GCM exeeds 4.5 tonnes in NSW so that the rear overhang is within 3.7 metres.
When I get a chance, I plan to post a review of the trailer's performance during my recent Kimberly trip in the Australia Group [on edit] because I don't want to trigger a US Australian war about relative technology

[raycarlson]

your hichball is about 3-4 inches to low for good surge brake function.sorry to see how restrictive and intrusive your government is in your personal life there.something as simple as making your own trailer doesn't require that much government interference.

[jimbo]

Boblee

The trailer was detached from the vehicle, and weighed in at 1900 kgs with as much out as I could get.
Vehicle with trailer and boat attached weighed 2460 kgs.
Vehicle without trailer attached weighed 2180 kgs.
Therefore, the ball weight was 280 kgs.

Hope this helps.

Would love to get a 2500 kgs trailer!

Stan

Just to document for others that might read this thread. I just weighted my new acquisition. A 2011 M. It is a basic fit out. No stove or fridge / freezers or water storage. Came with 60hp Etec and auto steer. Basic set of sails. Came in at 1840kg ATM ( trailer+boat+tow ball) and 1640 GTM (trailer + boat) i.e. 200kg on the tow ball.

[Oskar 26M]

Thanks Jimbo
Very useful information. I've posted a few cautions in the Australia Group thread
Cheers
Gordon

[Boblee]

So with a legal ATM of 1905 kg's you can add 65kgs? or have the later trailers got a higher rating?

Actually am very close to making a decision on which way to go with ours but think for future saleability will put a tandem under it with cruiser hubs and disc's on all wheels, it still works out much cheaper than replacing the whole trailer.

[kurz]

Hi Boblee
This is what I did. But remember: Will you get papers for the bigger loads? I dont know what the rules are where you live, but I was lucky to find a trailer builder who confirmed the 2500kg.

[Boblee]

G'day Kurz
Yes have two options with trailer mobs who are prepared to upgrade the trailer providing I use their bits, want to use disc brakes which means an actuator to maintain electric control and that adds a further $750.
Got a blurb from the former RTA now RMS saying to be careful using gal springs re certification but don't really have a problem with non gal springs or non gal solid axles.
Where I am hesitating is the use of disc or drum, disc's would obviously be better in water but there is a fair bit of extra cost involved in using them above 2 ton rating.
Mind you even when we were towing with the Hilux at one stage we had no brakes from home on the Murray to Grafton and it really wasn't noticeable and nor did it damage the hilux drums as they were still great at 180,000k's.
Anybody here have any stories about why I shouldn't use electric drum brakes? on the trailer.

[bartmac]

Having spoken to many people re electric drum brakes and boat trailers....concensus appears to be that the drums & shoes are the same but the activating mechanism in hydraulic brakes are more complicated than electric coils and more prone to corrosion.....hence advice is to go electric making sure all connection are completely water tight and accept regular replacement of the bit that rot....certainly the rest of the circuit in electric is easier and cheaper including fitment than hydraulic.
The trailer I've now got is rated at 2700kgs (Manufactures spec) but for some reason the rego papers are only for 2400kgs????

[Oskar 26M]

bartmac:

The inconsistency between your rego papers and the manufacturers specs could be due to the load rating of the tyres that were fitted when it was submitted for inspection.

When I upgraded the Mac trailer my target was for 3 tonnes on a single axle.

The trailer guy procured springs, axle, hubs and brakes that all met the 3 tonne spec but he (rather stupidly) submitted the trailer for inspection with the original Mac tyres. Those tyres are only rated for 1150 kg, so naturally it failed to make the grade. The trailer guy then "discovered" that he could not source 15" tyres rated for 1500kg so he switched to some (old Landcruiser) 17" rims for which he was able to get tyres rated for 1400 kg.

Hence the capacity of the upgraded trailer was set (by the tyres) at 2.8 tonnes.

The larger rims and higher profile tyres meant that the mudguards also had to be changed . The trailer also ended up several inches higher than the original so launching a retrieval was a lot more difficult