Comments on used boat please

[RickJ]

I've just been looking at a 2nd-hand (obviously - there aren't any new ones!), with a view to buying it. I'd be interested in any comments on some of the things I found.

This is in the UK, the boat is a 97 model, asking price £12.5k which is very reasonable for over here (most Xs go for a lot more, and the M new is around £20k base price excluding engine etc.).

1. Engine is a Suzuki 55 2-stroke. I'm not so keen on 2-strokes, but any comments on this engine? I think it's the original (need to confirm), the clock shows only 196 hrs. which suggests to me the boat hasn't been heavily used. Due to the way the boat's parked it wasn't possible to run the engine up at the time.

2. There is a lot of water in the bilges, probably 2-3 in. at the centre line. I'm told the boat's hardly been used this year so I guess it's rain water. I know the shround anchor points can leak, so are prime suspect, and are also easily sealed. Are there any other weak points where the rain can get in? I didn't see any evidence of leaks around the windows.

Those are the two main things I'm concerned about. Otherwise the boat's in good condition, and with a lot of gear and equipment thrown in. It even has a stern arch with lines to lift a tender (hmm....) and wind generator! An adjustable backstay's been fitted; there's only the two basic sails, but the main has 3-point single-line reefing. Twin-axle galvanised trailer as well.

I noticed the ballast tank seems to be an interim arrangement, must have been when they started tweaking it. The vent is still in the step, but there's no hull valve, and the transom valve is the big-bore one used on the later boats.

I think I'm going to make an offer for it, but I'd like to know if I might be buying myself a big problem - aargghh!

TIA
Rick

[bastonjock]

Hi Rickj

I bought a 2001x this year for 14k,i had a good look around and from the sound of it yours is a good deal.The condition of the engine effects the value of the boat greatly,if you need to replace it your looking at £4-6k for a new one.

i did look at a 97x and that too had water in th bilges,the guy said it was rain water

my boat did not come with a lot of extras,but it was like a brand new boat,when you openned the hatch cover it just smelled new,the bilges are bone dry.

your double axle is a big advantage if you intend to tow a lot

where abouts in the uk are you?

Matt

[Catigale]

Well, if the boat is parked I doubt the water in the bilges is sea water



A motor that cant be started and test run has a sales value of 0 - currency units not relevant imho...take the cost of a new one right off the top.

Price out a new 55 HP 2 stroke (Im guessing 5-6000 Lsd in the UK) and your 'deal' becomes a bad deal awfully quick

[RickJ]

Hi Matt

Your 2001 at £14k sounds a good deal too. I saw a 96 on Hayling Island that had been horrendously neglected and needed some hard work (and money), and they were asking £15k for it! The broker had already told the owner he'd need to drop his price, but I think he was just trying to see what offers he could get.

Other boats in good condition from 00 or 01 are going for around £17k.

I'm on the Isle of Wight, there's nothing on offer here but I spent yesterday on the mainland going from Hayling Island to Calshot to Beaulieu! Perhaps things are more expensive in this area.

Towing is either going to be a little or a lot. I won't be towing it much on the Island, not much point, and there's only about three viable launch sites anyway. But if/when I do take it somewhere else it's likely to be quite a distance - maybe Europe.

If you've any ideas about where the rain gets in, let me know!

Cheers
Rick

[Tom Walsh]

There are 3 types of macgregor boats
the type that leaks rainwater
the type that used to leak rainwater
and the type that is going to leak rainwater
probably the worse leak (toughest to fix) would be the ballast tank, but it is still something you can fix. For less than $50.00 you can put (what we used to call) a fiberglass sandwhich on any hull or ballast leak, if you can get to it, if not then you will have to operate as in cutting. I would bet rainwater, you could taste it to determine salinity,
if the boat was used in the sea. That might be sickening but not fatal.
If the outboard is no good then you have that to deal with , how much to spend a cheap used small hp, or the 50hp or better bankrupting new kicker.
Tom

[RickJ]

A motor that cant be started and test run has a sales value of 0 - currency units not relevant imho...take the cost of a new one right off the top.

If I make the guy an offer it'll be conditional on being able to run the motor. It was just that the boat was parked hard back against a fence, and the yard didn't have the time to both pull it out and then connect a cooling clamp and probably a booster battery to start it. The owner wasn't present, he'd just asked the yard to open it up and let me crawl all over it.

I'm more interested in whether 196 hrs. sounds high/normal/low over 10 years (sounds low to me), and what the Suzuki 55 is like generally as an engine.

Cheers
Rick

[Catigale]

196 hours is low for an engine but the determining factor is how well it has been maintained - has it been fogged every winter so that the cylinder havent rusted for example??

I dont know the Suzuki line so I cant comment on a 10 year old engine - be aware that in this day of corporate mergers the Suzuki of today might not be the same as the one of 10 years ago - there is a lot of rebadging of motors and drivetrains.

Before you taste the bilge, check and make sure the head and/or holding tank isnt leaking....

Dont sweat rainwater coming in - those leaks are easy to fix...or at least control

[bastonjock]

Hi rick

i looked at jeremy coles boat"souwester sam" it is a 99 or 98,it was avery well equipped boat but at £16.5k i thought it was alittle high.

The 97 i looked at witha 2 stroke tohatsu and rain water was well overpriced for its condidion,it had a lot of marks on the hull and the transome had gelcote cracks in it,the guy wanted £15k but said he would negotiate,i felt i did not have the experience to sort it out.

i got a good deal on mine,it is in absolute pristine condition,mind you i put more scratches on the hull in one weekend than the prevoius owner had in 4 years,it used to be the Macgregor dealers boat

If a boat has been for sale for a while then its a bit over priced,i missed a great deal on a 98 with a twin axle trailer,4 stroke engine,lots of extras at 13.5k

I ended up expanding my search grid to find the boat that i wanted

[bastonjock]

196 hours is low for an engine but the determining factor is how well it has been maintained - has it been fogged every winter so that the cylinder havent rusted for example??

I dont know the Suzuki line so I cant comment on a 10 year old engine - be aware that in this day of corporate mergers the Suzuki of today might not be the same as the one of 10 years ago - there is a lot of rebadging of motors and drivetrains.

Before you taste the bilge, check and make sure the head and/or holding tank isnt leaking....

Dont sweat rainwater coming in - those leaks are easy to fix...or at least control

steve what do you mean by "fogged" and how do you do it?,you have me reaching for the maintenace manual now

[Rob Roy]

Hi Rick

I was delighted to buy my 2000 26X a few weeks ago for £13,000 (also with a bilge full of rainwater) until I saw on ebay a nice Mac X at Beaulieu which went unsold at £10k!

Unfortunately, as a newbie, I'm not authorised to post the link but if you search ebay UK for ref number 140156440370 you'll find it & figure out the bottom line.

I've just sold my much loved Baby Mac 19 to buy the Big Mac & can't wait for launch next spring.

Good luck, you'll love it - I'm only in Dartmouth so I'll probably run into you ...

[tangentair]

(most Xs go for a lot more, and the M new is around £20k base price excluding engine etc.).

Over here a new boat's cost is about 1/2 to 2/3s the initial cost to use it. You would have to read a lot of the Mods to come up with a final estimate that does not include maintenance. Still, the biggest nonboat expense is the outboard. And depending upon your usage area, it might be one of your must-have most-reliable devices on board. I would really consider a defective or marginal engine to be more than an annoyance it is a handicap at best.
However the point I would make is you might want to negotiate that 20K pounds number - the way the US dollar is falling, they can not justify it except for trying to recap current inventory costs.

[RickJ]

196 hours is low for an engine but the determining factor is how well it has been maintained - has it been fogged every winter so that the cylinders haven't rusted for example??

Good point!

Before you taste the bilge, check and make sure the head and/or holding tank isn't leaking....

Yuk! We're OK in this case though, it's a porta-potty not a sea toilet

[jasper]

"the way the US dollar is falling, they can not justify it except for trying to recap current inventory costs."

With the falling US Dollar, you would expect prices in other countries to drop. However, it just ain't happening, not yet anyhow. Vehicles in Canada are still at much inflated prices over US. It will be interesting to see if the 26M becomes cheaper in Canada for 2008,of course, we would need to factor in shipping costs as well. But I can bet that even without the shipping costs, the US base price will be a lot less than the Canadian base price.

[Catigale]

Fogging - usually when you lay an engine up for winter storage you put some oil in the cylinders and turn the engine over by hand to let the cylinders get coated with engine oil to prevent rusting.

On my 2003 Merc BF, the manual tells you to remove the spark plugs and put some amount of oil onto the top of the piston.

Other manufacturers recommendation vary, but all are basically doing the same thing.

[RickJ]

I saw on ebay a nice Mac X at Beaulieu which went unsold at £10k!

That's the one! I never saw the ebay ad, but I found it on Boats&Outboards as a private ad. I've today agreed £10k for it, which I reckon is a bargain. Tidying it up will be a nice winter project

I was looking for a 19 to start with, but it's hard to find one on offer - I might have bought yours if I'd known! I've never actually seen one, but I liked the more compact size, presumably much easier to trail?

Perhaps MacGregor should revive it for the European market - smaller roads, smaller cars.

Cheers