Honda 50 HP problem

[Phil M]

I too have a Honda BF50A on my 26M. Last summer, while using the reverse gear after launch, the small pin inside the throttle lever holding the cable came loose, and my engine was stuck in reverse without my knowledge. So when I put it in forward, the sailboat travelled BACKWARDS, and scared the hull out of me. We nearly crashed into a concrete abutment near the pier. I failed to immediately recognize my sailboat travelling backwards when the lever was put in the forward position. It must have been obvious to an onlooker, but it took me too long to figure it out.
I anchored for the evening. The next morning I disassembled the throttle lever, found the small pin, and was able to continue sailing for the weekend.
Except for that incident (and wide open throttle only attaining 5300 rpm instead of the 6000 rpm), I am reasonably satisfied with my Honda outboard.

Phil M

[opie]

I think we all are reasonably satisfied with our Hondas, but does the M have the same design as the X where the two cables get bent sideways on the steering bar when the motor is raised?

[Kelly Hanson East]

This is only my second season as a owner. This is not an excuse, merely an explanation of why I was not better prepared.

And a perfectly reasonable one at that, imho. There are a lot of 'useless gurus' out there who boom out gospel about sailing (I recall one instructor who 'forbade docking under engine power') as a personal ego crutch more than trying to truly instruct in the art of the sport. Speaking for myself, I will never be a blue water, around the world Sir Peter Blake racer/cruiser/guru - and 99.999 of the rest of the boating community wont be either, except in their own minds. There are a couple on this Board of course, Im not one of them.

"Dont go sailing until you are experienced" has a rather obvious logical flaw (other than accepting that the number of sailors will eventually tend to zero)

Maybe I can share one of my season one/two gaffs here as encouragement that the first two seasons of steep learning curve are survivable at least

In short - if your 150 genoa is stuck on the furler in 25 knots, dont put your finger in the clew ring to pull it out....

[Phil M]

I think we all are reasonably satisfied with our Hondas, but does the M have the same design as the X where the two cables get bent sideways on the steering bar when the motor is raised?

The cables on the M are bent slightly when the motor is raised, but it's hard to say whether it is worse for the X or M. It might be the same amount. I don't think the steering bar is much of a factor. Maybe it also depends on how the cables are routed into the motor too. I raise my motor all the time, so I'll have to see if I encounter the same problem with the cables breaking as others have.
Phil

[NiceAft]

Opie wrote:

I think we all are reasonably satisfied with our Honda's, but does the M have the same design as the X where the two cables get bent sideways on the steering bar when the motor is raised?

I don't have a clue, so here are pictures of my Honda 50, both down and up. Is this the same as everyone else's? I have not had a problem, and from the pictures, I don't see one happening.




Ray

[opie]

I am not near the X boat to take a picture, but the X is entirely different than your M it appears. No, you do not have the problem many of us X owners have. Can someone take and post an X picture of the steering bar and the pretzel move the steering and throttle cables have to go through to pass under the bar each time you raise to the highest level? Bad. Does anyone have a mod to make the X steering and cable clearance more like the M?

[aya16]

nice aft, it looks as the cables are bent to much, seem hard to shift? throttle have lots of resistance? We need two foot loop in our cables for smooth operation, and long life.
Mike

[opie]

I found some pics I took a couple of years ago, before the obvious extreme stress broke one of the cables.



http://lh6.ggpht.com/_wsa0BGpYZXE/Sh5-X ... G_1046.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_wsa0BGpYZXE/Sh5-X ... G_1049.JPG
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_wsa0BGpYZXE/Sh5-X ... G_1053.JPG

[NiceAft]

aya,

I am not certain whether you were asking, or telling me that the cables are too bent. I don't think they are.

seem hard to shift? throttle have lots of resistance?

No, and no!

Does anyone have any photos showing what they believe to be properly bent cables for an M

Ray

[aya16]

I was making an observation before based on the photo.
A two foot round bend is what my installation manual says, ideally would be a straight run.
opie pix's looks right except a little more loop than needed. But you can see the extreme bend when the motor is tilted up at the steering bar.
opie are those cables now run under the steering?

My new cables are run in a loop all the way to the back of the "M" motor well in a loop. The Honda also has the cables enter the opposite side of the engine then mine too.
Mike

[Michael]

If you have enough slack in the cable, you could try putting a loop in the cable. This would change the angle of the cable to the motor. (On the X the cable works much better under the steering bar)


Also, the use of sacrificial cable covers will act as a chafe guard against the cable constantly rubbing on the no-skid.

[opie]

Will not putting the cables under the steering bar result in a similar problem when the motor tilts down on an X? Could you take a pic of what the cables do when you tilt down the mtor?

Is there anyway I could mod my X to get rid of the steering bar topside, like the M seems to do?

[NiceAft]

Aya,

Maybe you're right Who knows This will be our fifth season, and there isn't any sign of wear on the cables. Time will tell

Ray

[aya16]

I dont think you can get away with not kinking the cables some what. But from the pix of the x transom it looks like the less kinking would be under the steering. The loop Michael shows looks ok, doesnt look kinked at all at full tilt and it doesnt look like they would have any kink at full down either. Sort have to play with it I guess. Seems ideal if the cables come out of the boat on the opposite side of where they attach to the engine. all my motors the cables enter the left side of the motor, looks like Honda, the shifter and the throttle are on the right. In the case of the "M" the cables come out of the left side of the boat.

What Michael did, or has, is like mine on the "M", cross over loop. His idea of the split plastic tubing over the cable keeps the cable from chafing, but hides potential problems if the cable cracks. So feeling a tight shift and throttle will alert us of cables that start to wear. I got 23 years out of cables on the whaler with that plastic split tube over the cables, the sun and the wear from friction was almost eliminated.
Although the plastic tube was replaced a few times as it rots over time. Same thing would have happened to the cable plastic if it wasnt protected.

Opie the kink you show in your pix, would certainly accelerate cable failure in a much shorter time than normal. Especially if you sail with the motor tilted up, and the engine moves with the rudders. Not only is there an extreme bend in the cable, which would flex and possibly break the metal wrap inside the cable, but you have a constant wear point from the steering bar. It looks like if you went under the bar and put the plastic split tube on, you would be ok.

It also looks like the bar is rubbing on the wires going to the motor, over time it could rub through, and short out the motor. There again plastic split tubing could save the day for you. Besides shorting, those are battery cables too, you could have a fire if that shorts out.
Mike

[aya16]

Aft on yours it looks as though that a full turn to the left would pull on the cables and have even more kink, a few more inches of slack would loosen up your steering some. Im guessing but it looks as though your wires and cables pull in and out of the boat as you turn. If they dont then what could happen on yours is the holder for the shift cables inside your engine is getting a lot of stress, on my older merc, that holder is plastic. I dont know what honda uses.

I got 23 years from cables on the whaler and they still look and work like new, but the whaler cables had no stress, a long loop, and was protected from a split tube. Your cables look ok, except the loop, and if the cables pull in and out of the boat then theres probably not much stress on them anyway. But you do have an area that will leak water into the boat onto the bed. My through hull boot is zipped tied around a plastic tube to make it water tight as possible.

Im not telling any one how to rig their boat, just observation on the pix I see.

cables rarely just fail, it takes time and they go slowly, shifting and the throttle get stiffer before they break or freeze up. Problem is over time we get used to the friction and feel its normal. The shifter and throttle should be smooth as glass if the cables are installed right and the friction screw on the throttle handle is adjusted right.

Just a guess and to make it fun, I would guess that when your cables do fail (many years from now) it starts with the plastic coating on the end of the cable coming loose from the end of the metal flange at the engine side, the cables will still work but will have more slack and the wrap metal inside the cable will separate and pull apart,(stretch). The cables will still work, but you wont get full throttle and the shifting will be sloppy.
Mike