Winch Rant

A forum for discussing topics relating to MacGregor Powersailor Sailboats
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Sumner
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by Sumner »

mgmathews wrote:Sumner, Have you tested it to see if your winch handle really floats? -Mike
I just did and it does. Only the winch end is out of the water, but it does float.

Just a note and that is the handle fits the winch on our Image. I don't know how universal these are and if the winches on the :macm: and :macx: are the same as the Image
RussMT wrote:..The handle in your link looks good. I would strongly suggest a locking handle (like the one above) as on my old boat I watched a $50 handle slide down the deck and plop into the water when a crew person accidentally knocked it out (and it promptly sank).....--Russ
I can say with conviction that my tools don't seem to float :cry: . Not a good feeling seeing a wrench come out of your hand and into the water and kind of wave goodbye in that .......

Image

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... -koot.html

......crystal clear mountain lake water as it heads to the bottom,

Sum

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Last edited by Sumner on Thu Jun 17, 2010 12:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Catigale
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by Catigale »

Easily retrievable with a type 316 magnet on a line
:wink:
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Russ
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by Russ »

Sumner wrote:Just a note and that is the handle fits the winch on our Image. I don't know how universal these are and if the winches on the :macm: and :macx: are the same as the Image
I'm fairly certain they are standard.

Catigale wrote:Easily retrievable with a type 316 magnet on a line
You mean like this oneImage

I've marked the spot with a GPS of where my digital camera went overboard. It's in relatively shallow (25 feet) water and I may try a magnet to get 'er back. Fishin' fun. Maybe the SD card is salvageable.


--Russ
bwygirl
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by bwygirl »

As a dealer for MacGregor boats one of the things we do before delivery is go over the boat to the best of our ability to repair factory defects. I personally spend over 6 hours on each boat I deliver CLEANING with laquer thinner and a scrub brush and donating my fingernails to cleaning in the non-skid areas. A good dealer makes sure that when the boat is received it is clean, and ready for the customer. We do this to the best of our abilities. It sounds to me that the fellow who started this subject did not have a good dealer to take care of him. Hanging down wires, yup we fix that. Messy sealant on deck, yup we fix that too. Fiberglass dust inside, yup but nothing but time fixes that because it comes down from the drill holes from the deck. No one can get it out, just jiggles out eventually. Your dealer should also have had a demo boat to show you that was current so you would not have been mislead with the old window trim. There is a new brochure out now that shows the current type. Also, your dealer should have been able to do any gel coat touch up as needed or you should have been able to bring the boat back to the dealer to fix it. We did have a customer unhappy this year, he was able to bring us back the boat and we did all the repairs he wanted. He is now happy. For over 20 years this is what we have been doing, taking a factory boat and making it a fun, nice, and enjoyable boat for owners. The factory builds them, dealers take it from there...

The trailer winch has been a problem not because of its quality but of how the boat is loaded onto the trailer. You need to not go too deep with the trailer when loading the boat. We have launched 1000's of these boats with this winch and not had one break!

The cabin top winch, for the jib or genoa, is a bugger. We are currently considering offering an upgraded winch for our customers, we will go to the Lewmar 6 as an upgrade.

We really love the MacGregor boats and want people to be happy with them. If you have a problem give me a call and I will try to help. We do sell a small patch paste kit in tan that would touch up the interior, call me and I will send you one. Also if you want to talk with Todd about the launching / loading of the trailer you can reach him at [email protected] he would be valuable to you to talk with.

No, I don't let my kids or grandkids play on other peoples lawn....
All my best to you, enjoy your boat!
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Catigale
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by Catigale »

Well done, Cheryl.
flyboy26m
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by flyboy26m »

I thought the trailer was very well built. I don't know enough about winches to know if the DL 1100A is a good winch but it is made in the USA.

2"of paint flaked off from the steel part of the trailer with surface rust but I can take care of that-no big deal it can happen to any trailer.

I like the SS breaks with buddy bearings and coupler all made in the USA.

The dealer showed me the hardware he was replacing in his upgrade package I purchased and it made a lot of sense.

I can control the Main and jib from the Helm and I love that.

The dealer instructed me as I raised and lowered the mast and secured it for trailering. It all seemed very straight forward.

We spent about 6 hours with the dealer and enjoyed his perspective on the boat and the manufacture.

I like the fact I could partisipate in the rigging of the boat.

I purchased 200 feet of anchor rope with 25 feet of chain and a 25 lbs mason Anchor from West Marine.

50 hp 4 stroke Yamaha High Thrust Motor.

So far so good
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NiceAft
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by NiceAft »

Phil M wrote:
bartmac wrote:I don't understand......not using winches.....how can you possible achieve sail trim without the use of winches even for a standard jib
How? Head up into the wind to ease the pressure and then adjust your sail. Or, cut so close to the wind that the sail starts flapping. You would never win a race, but it works.

Phil M :macm:
I have never used the handle for the Genny winch. I just pull the line. The Admiral is my crew. When she can't pull, she just hands me the line, and I pull up the slack. I have been in some good winds, and the winch handle is something that just sits in the winch. I don't know why I even leave it there.

Ray
flyboy26m
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by flyboy26m »

Sorry the first part of my post was cut off.

I visited the factory before purchase.

Me and my Nephew just picked up the new M26 this weekend.

I will post updates as my experience with the boat unfolds.

I love it so far!
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NiceAft
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by NiceAft »

flyboy26m,

Congratulations on the new boat. Have a great sailing season (wherever you may be?), with many more to follow.

Ray
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mabuhay
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by mabuhay »

My winch broke last weekend as I was pulling the boat out of the water...the winch bracket broke at the lower bolt...the stock winch is certainly inadequate for the boat when the water ballast is full. I replaced it with another cheap winch I bought at Wal-Mart...it was only $33 and bolted up with no problems. It is only a 1200lb winch, so not much of an upgrade, but the bracket does seem a little beefier, so maybe it will last longer than the three years the stock winch lasted.
flyboy26m
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by flyboy26m »

I just recently took delivery of a 2010 26m. My winch only had 24 inches of strap on it. The winch bracket is deforming at the bolts already so I plan on replacing it with heavy duty and 20 feet of strap. Funny thing was, their is a second winch manual in one of the hatches from a different and stronger winch.

I still love my 26m.

Michael
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ALX357
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by ALX357 »

IMHO, the winch is not NOT for forcibly dragging the boat onto the trailer.

If the trailer is in deep enough, float the boat all the way onto it, pulling it into the V with the winch strap, and then back off the strap a little ..... or engine drive it onto the trailer until it noses into the V-notch, then take up MOST of the slack, but leave a little. When the trailer is pulled out, and the boat settles onto the bunks fully, there will usually be a bit of space created between the boat nose and the V-notch. That is the time for the "bump" , to seat the boat again into the V ..... ONLY THEN take up all the slack with the winch.

Yup, it's a counter-intuitive thing, but you just cannot expect the boat to settle fully and correctly on the trailer until after it is pulled out. The boat floats on water, level, and the trailer sits on a sloped ramp.

You can't reasonably expect to drag the boat onto the trailer bunks with the winch alone. And you can't expect to have the boat set properly on the trailer when it settles, without breaking the winch, if the winch strap is tight before it settles.

If you just take up the slack lightly with the winch, there will be enough slack in the strap or rope winding on the drum to pull out, but if it's really tight, as after dragging the boat onto the bunks of the trailer, ... well,

The strap can't stretch that much, and neither the strap nor the hull can be expected to defeat the basic geometry of the situation. With the huge pivoting leverage of 28 feet and 3000+ lbs. the winch is almost sure to fail at some point. If the winch strap is snugged really tightly on the drum, it's only over a short distance of a few inches, but that's an averaged torque of about 42,000 lbs. on the winch, strap, hook, eye, and boat-nose , whichever is the first to go. ( It's abuse, so be thankful it is the " sacrificial" winch that fails first in this case. )

Keep in mind that abusing the winch is not the only mistake that is easy to make on the Mac ... you can get the boat stuck on the trailer with the centerboard down a bit in front of the crossmember, swamp the boat with partial ballast, break the steering gear with half-deployed rudders, or chew them up with the prop, break the gooseneck with accidental jibes, ( no joke ;-) ) and blow yourself up in smoke while grilling out in the cockpit with the gas cans under your butt.

It's a tricky boat, for sure.
flyboy26m
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by flyboy26m »

Thank you for the insight. That makes a lot of sense. Maybe I will just keep the winch.

I will try and remember the other stuff too.

I started too type up a check list like we use in flying so I might lesson those problems.

The list is growing :)
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ALX357
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by ALX357 »

Another counter-intuitive thing ... the MacBump does not work so well if the winch strap or line to the bow eye has been tightened, because it pulls the bow down hard onto the trailer bunk in front, and binds the boat from sliding into final trailering position with its nose into the V-notch of the trailer. Temporarily ease off the winch pressure on the nose, and the intertial bump works easier.
Last edited by ALX357 on Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Doug W
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Re: Winch Rant

Post by Doug W »

I've added a roller behind the front V-bunk which seems to help on ramps with shallow angles. I also prefer to use a ramp with wind/wave blowing towards the ramp from behind, I never seem to need a mac bump when I have nature helping to push her onto the trailer. I also had better luck loading all the way forward with the ballast empty; however, handling around the ramp pier then isn't as easy even with all three fins down.

Doug
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