Best battery for a trolling motor on a Dinghy?

[gryff57]

Wow, one read through this thread and you'd wonder why all of us aren't driving stink boats instead of sail. Not to get started on the path to a "greenie weenie" argument, but the wind IS solar powered.

[Hardcrab]

I'll second Mikes 2hp Honda with one warning: It's somewhat of a bear to pull start.
But the air cooled 4 stroke, built in gas tank, centrifical clutch for the prop (just add throttle to go), spin around reverse, and 27lbs are a hard package to beat.

The Admiral can not pull start it at all, even with pre-setting the motor to after top dead center to help lower the effort.
The little flywheel/recoil starter pulley does not have very much mechanical leverage to get it turning.
Even with the dinky piston and small amount of compression, it's harder than you would ever guess.
I have yet to try a bigger handle on the rope, it might help.

Try one out if you can first, or perhaps get the admiral to try one--- it could be a show stopper, IHMO.

Or else you do ALL of the dinking.

[Kittiwake]

Choices I know of, honda 2hp....suz 2.5...tohatsu 3...merc 3... same as tohatsu I think... sorry none will give the mac a hard push against a current. but will serve a non planing dinghy well and will mount up to the swim ladder for storage while underway.

We went with the Susuki 2.5 because it is so light. We hang it off one of the Mac stern rail-seats when not using it on the dinghy. As I indicated earlier in this thread, although I was excited to get it for the dinghy, we hardly ever use it on the dinghy. Nevertheless I do not regret having it because it will likely be better than rowing the Mac in the event of E-tec 60 issues ... especially since I tend to leave the mast at home on long trailering trips to isolated areas. I would caution that, even the Suzuki 2.5 is plenty of weight to be hefting about while at sea: this situation is nothing like lifting it on the showroom floor! By the way Crikey, that is a heck of a good price you got.

I was amused though when I first used the Suzuki: one gets so spoiled by the electric-start computer-controlled E-tec that firing up and using the tiny Suzuki really jerked me back 40 years to the 'good old days' of outboard motors - you get to fiddle with the choke and the throttle and pamper the little critter as it snorts about.

I have not set up the Mac to use the Suzuki, figuring (on the advice of a sailor friend) that, if I have to use the Suzuki to move the Mac I will lash the dinghy to one side of it and run the tiny OB from the dinghy. How do folks feel about this?
Kittiwake

[Sumner]

....If you get the long shaft dink motor performance will suffer as well as beaching the dink some. So the short shaft is best with the dink....

Since none of these little outboards are going to get a dinghy up on plane I'm not sure that you would notice much performance difference with the long shaft. We never run the 3 1/2 HP wide open as it just doesn't go much faster that way.

You do need 5 inches more water beaching or you can do like....



...we did and raise the transom 5 inches if that is an option...



... with your dinghy...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... iac-3.html

... If I was going to put an outboard on an S or D or some of the older Mac's/Ventures setup for a long shaft (realize there aren't that many owners on here) I would give the long shaft serious consideration as you could use it to get home without worrying about cavitation. You are going to struggle if there are big currents.

If you are an X or M owner there is probably no advantage looking for a long shaft.

The Tohatsu and I'm sure the other water cooled 4 strokes are very quiet, especially at part throttle. We have heard more than one person on a dock mention that as we motored by.

I also pump from...




...the tank we have on the dinghy that was for the 5 HP into the 3 1/2 HP's internal tank with a regular bulb and hose. It goes fast as the tank is so small.

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

[mastreb]

I think the really big issue for me is power to weight. You can kind of see where the various MFRs have their sweetspots.

The Honda 2hp is apparently the lightest O/B in the world at 27lbs. That's great, but 2hp is almost certainly not sufficient for emergency backup duty. Also it's expensive--same price as other 3.5hp.

The Suzuki DF2.5 is next lightest at 30 lbs. even. But I cannot find a single vendor online with a price. Probably you have to buy them at a dealer, which I'm not interested in. Looks like a great little motor though, wish I could figure out what they cost.

The Tohatsu, Nissan, and Mercury 3.5hp have the same 40lb. weight specification and might be the same motors. These same MFRs have 2.5hp motors weight nearly the same and cost nearly the same so they're not a value. ON EDIT: The Mercury is a different motor, the Nissan/Tohatsu are the same. Apparently the Mercury has serious problems with ethanol fuel with numerous owners reporting unreliable operation due to it on West Marine's forums. Anyone see this problem?

The Yamaha 2.5 outboard also weighs the same as the Tohatsu/Nissan/Mercury 3.5, and costs the same. Their next motor up is a 60lb. 4hp, so they're out on power:weight ratio.

There are really inexpensive "Coleman Outboards" in the market for $650 at 2.6hp but they weigh as much as the Tohatsu 3.5.

So it looks like the Tohatsu/Nissan/Mercury is the way to go for best price/weight/power performance in an under 50lb. outboard motor. I'd like to get more info about the Suzuki 2.5, but I just can't find a retailer online and I don't want to deal with a dealer so I guess its out.

Anybody ever drop one of these things in the drink?

[Crikey]

Yo Matt, look at the link on my post - they're shipping free anywhere in the US at their sale price ($709). When I checked Canadian prices at a number of different places, with our currency on par, they came out $300 to $400 more before taxes. Go figure! It's apparently a new model DF2.5S according to the sales rep, and so far I haven't located what the difference is between this, and the previous one. We have a Kinek UPS holding store in Lewiston N.Y., and got it shipped there for pickup.
Funny thing, I think this was the place (Florida) that you turned me onto with the great deal for my Baystar hydraulic steering kit. Hope I can return the favour for you in this case.
And thanks for chiming in guys - makes me feel a whole lot better about my self-induced Valentines Day present.
Ross

[Kittiwake]

Yo Matt, look at the link on my post - they're shipping free anywhere in the US at their sale price ($709). When I checked Canadian prices at a number of different places, with our currency on par, they came out $300 to $400 more before taxes. .... Ross

Yes, we paid ~$300 more for the Suzuki 2.5 as I recall ... and we did purchase it from a dealer.
You know Sum and mastreb, I don't think I have ever towed our inflatable dinghy with the motor on it: I always suspect that it would be more 'flippable' with the motor on ... and I guess I'd be even more concerned if the engine were heavier and/or raised higher on the transom (the way you have it Sum). Of course we are always in the ocean, and often exposed to sizeable waves that can come upon you rather abruptly when you round a spit or whatever.
Kittiwake

[Sumner]

..You know Sum and mastreb, I don't think I have ever towed our inflatable dinghy with the motor on it: I always suspect that it would be more 'flippable' with the motor on ... and I guess I'd be even more concerned if the engine were heavier and/or raised higher on the transom (the way you have it Sum). Of course we are always in the ocean, and often exposed to sizeable waves that can come upon you rather abruptly when you round a spit or whatever.
Kittiwake

We don't tow with it on either, except once when I forgot to take it off, but didn't have a problem. When we are moving from place to place it goes....



...on the mount shown above.....

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... de-12.html

...... Taking it off was the reason for going to the 3 1/2 HP to get the lower weight. It really was not fun putting the 5 HP off and on when on the water, even if the water was flat. There are a number of times that we never put the 5 HP on at anchorages in Canada, Idaho and Lake Powell where shore was close. In Florida we want it on the dinghy a lot more and the 40 lb. smaller outboard is not that bad. I put it on and off a number of times on our two trips there.

I find it is easier to bring the outboard into the cockpit where Ruth can then help. We usually have the dingy tied....



...to the side of the boat on anchor and it is pretty stable there vs. trying to do the mount/dismount off of the stern. I get into the dinghy and take the outboard over the coaming and into the dinghy and then mount it on the transom. This way it is never over open water although I don't like thinking about dropping it onto one of the dinghy tubes either .

So far we are very happy with the 3 1/2 HP and love the 9.8 HP. The Merc, Nissan and Tohatsu are all the same outboards made by Tohatsu and I think recently they just added one of the other big names to the list. We found non-ethanol fuel in Florida at marinas and will try and use that if possible in the future. I think the bigger problem and it isn't just with the smaller Tohatsu made outboards is the extremely small low-speed jets/passages they now have to run to meet regs. They plug very easily.

I also made a lift that could/can be used to raise the outboard on/off the back of the Mac....



http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... de-16.html

If we had a problem with the 9.8 HP I could move the 3 1/2 HP off of its perch and use the lift to raise the 9.8 HP on the spare mount next to the ladder and then put the 3 1/2 HP on the stern in the motor well.

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

[Catigale]

Anybody ever drop one of these things in the drink?

Who would own up to such foolishness?

Search for "why you don't keep your kicker in the boat in the northeast"

[Kittiwake]

....
We don't tow with it on either, except once when I forgot to take it off, but didn't have a problem. ....
.... I find it is easier to bring the outboard into the cockpit where Ruth can then help. We usually have the dingy tied....
.... to the side of the boat on anchor and it is pretty stable there vs. trying to do the mount/dismount off of the stern. I get into the dinghy and take the outboard over the coaming and into the dinghy and then mount it on the transom. ....
.... non-ethanol fuel in Florida at marinas and will try and use that if possible in the future. I think the bigger problem and it isn't just with the smaller Tohatsu made outboards is the extremely small low-speed jets/passages they now have to run to meet regs. They plug very easily.
....

Nice ... and interesting too.
Do you (or others) feel that, with a motor-equipped dinghy strapped to the side of the Mac in the fashion you show above, one could use the dinghy as a sort of small tugboat to move a disabled Mac?
Kittiwake

[Kittiwake]

Anybody ever drop one of these things in the drink?

Who would own up to such foolishness? ....

Heh heh ... actually, on this forum of friendly and honest sailors, I suspect members would tell their story gleefully ... in colourful detail ... complete with photographic evidence provided and anotated by their admirals.
Kittiwake

[Sumner]

....Do you (or others) feel that, with a motor-equipped dinghy strapped to the side of the Mac in the fashion you show above, one could use the dinghy as a sort of small tugboat to move a disabled Mac?
Kittiwake

First the photo above is on our site actually showing the strap (yellow) that we use to pull the dinghy from the transom vs. the bow eyes. The bow lines above remain slack while towing, but are there for redundancy. We use the strap to take stress off the bow and it has worked great, over 500 miles in FL. The strap hooks onto a metal eye on the transom motor mount and if we get in and want it out of the way I just unhook it there and lay it off to the side.

Also we leave the dinghy tied to the side at night as shown above. There is a little blue fender you can see there that keeps the carabiner on the line from banging on the hull. One reason we like the dingh there is that we worried a little about dinghy theft and felt it was more susceptible to that happening if it was swinging around off of the stern. Also tied there it isn't running into the stern of the boat and the rudder and outboard that are both up. For me it is easy to get in and out of over the coaming, but not for Ruth. For her I move it back to the ....



...ladder that is in the 'tow-bar' position (arrow above) and she uses it like a boarding platform. If I want to board back there I just put some slack in the bow line and push it back there.

Now to your question. I think the answer is yes in calm water. Sometimes we put two anchors down in a Bahamian Moor and if we are in the same place overnight or a day or two at times the rodes with twist around as the boat swings 360 degrees in wind or tide changes. When that happens I switch...



...the rodes on the side chocks by the rollers, but still sooner or later the mess has to be untangled and that was a pain. Then part way through the trip I got down in the dinghy and tied the stern of it also to the Mac, which I do transfering the outboard also. Next I fired up the 3 1/2 hp outboard and put it hard over and just used it to turn the Mac back around and untwist the rodes. Since the bow stays is about the same place on a Bahamian Moor with the two anchors 180 degrees from each other and the rodes pretty taut the boat just swung around. Worked great. So yes I think you could move the Mac in this manner, but it might not be the best way to do it for all situations. I think if the sea was 2-4 foot waves I'd want to maybe try towing from a ways in front of the boat and I'd want the inflatable to be similar to the Zodiac with a hard transom to attach to,

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

[aya16]

, cause everyone likes photos......no, I don't use them at the same time just thought it looked cool when I washed the dinghy one day. The 4hp bought on ebay, is lighter than the honda, and was bought on ebay for 300 bucks, performs really well and easy to start, but not good for the greenie weenie's, its a two stroke.

right on, about the honda being hard to pull start. Have to be part ape part man to get it going. I paid 300 hundred for that one used too. Ebay has some good deals on used outboards, just gotta be careful. these little outboards are really simple to work on just got to make sure they run before you buy them.

Again I like the suz 2.5 best, easy pull start and run great as well as being light weight. Anyone that ever planed a 9.5 foot or smaller dink knows its no fun, spray and a little wobbly, so a small engine is great for these small dinks.
Mike

[Hamin' X]

Just to get back to the original topic: I have gone through four (4) rotator cuff surgeries and am not able to pull start a cranky dighy motor, nor is the admiral. I picked up a slightly used electric at a second hand store for $20 and bought this battery to power it. Perfect and works a treat. http://www.apexbattery.com/upg-group-u1 ... power.html



$85 to my front door.
Weight 24
Volts 12
Amp-Hour 35
CCA 315
It starts my Suzi 50 with no problem.
It's an AGM battery and ships UPS.

~Rich

[mastreb]

Well Matt, I'm going to blame you for this! Your post got me into looking into small outboards for my new (as yet uninflated) inflatable that I bought at this winters local boat show. I found, and bought the following good deal - free shipping out of Florida:
http://www.boats.net/outboard_motor/Suz ... parts.html
Nothing like spending money, to save money (I'm beginning to sound like my wife)! Looking at several of the Youtube videos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxSVP1Oi ... re=related tells me it has all the power I need for my 7.5' dink, and at 30lbs even the admiral can set it up.
Ross

Crikey! That is a fantastic price.