still stumped adjusting shrouds

[DaveC426913]

My attempts to tune my standing rigging have stalled because I have not found a satisfactory way to adjust the shroud adjusters (apparently, they're known as Johnson adjusters).

I know in theory, the idea is to jam a screwdriver into a convenient slot and hold it there while you move the clevis pin, but in practice I found it virtually impossible to hold in place - let alone shorten - while the shroud is under tension.

I tried using my spare halyard to haul on the mast to ease the tension on one side, but my full weight did little to ease shroud tension. My next attempt will likely be to wrap the halyard around a winch - or run it down to a cleat on the dock, and use the righting moment of the boat to bed the mast.

Suggestions?

[Tomfoolery]

If you want to see a Johnson adjuster, watch my kid playing center field.

But to your issue, I'd suggest you cut the forestay loose using the MRS if you have one, back the mast back slightly, adjust some predetermined amount, and put the mast back and check. Rinse. Repeat as needed.

There are also tools you can use, under load, made from a Vice Grip. Lotta force possible with Vice Grips. And there are other methods, too, including a simple tool with a pair of pins to engage the male and female portion and apply force.

These are the two halves of the standard-issue stay adjusters for Macs.

[Whipsyjac]

There was a thread "what is this thing?" (Or something like that). Some late boats came with an adjuster. It can easily be made. A metal pipe or bar with a couple 3/16 machine bolts for pins. Put one pin in the shroud adjuster you want to change and the other in the shroud you're not. That will give you leverage off the fixed and attached shroud. Ie. To adjust the upper put a pin from your tool into the adjuster on the lower shroud for a fixed pivot point.

I had a friend control the mast with the jib halyard while I adjusted one shroud at a time. Have your helper keep a turn on the pulpit if you do this to avoid fatigue or butterfingers related disasters. Also get the biggest person you can find with a good attitude. The one time my brother in law helped me rig( he's a 6'2"-240lb stonemason) a toddler could've pinned the forestay.

I did mess with screw driver adjustments for the backstay and won't bother with that again. Watching the adjuster fly up like a missile past my helper's ear when the screwdriver slipped is definitely negligent of a Skipper's responsibility.

Hefty helper or special tool(I'm a tool and I'm special! Also push into hefty being a 200# stonemason who's nowhere near 6' tall)

Willy

[BOAT]

Yeah, Hi Whip, that was me - I posted that thingy deal I found in the boat right after I brought it home. It was a pipe with two screws sticking out. I never did use it. I prefer to use the mast raising winch and lower the mast just a little bit cuz the MRS has baby stays that keep the mast in place while you reset those "Johnson things" or whatever their called (to me it's a turnbuckle) it's real easy that way and no one gets hurt.
I'm sorry but I already removed that picture from the photobucket - it did not look like anyone was interested in that post anymore.
If you must do this with the mast up you can also use a piece of wood stick with two screws in it. (I'm surprised any of the older boats have these - I would have figured you guys all for turnbuckles).

If no one puts up any pictures here I will take a new one and post it.

[Paulieb]

I have also seen people use two Awl tools to "walk" the adjuster down to the desired hole. The longer point on the tools makes it easier to use than a screwdriver.

Use 2 Awl tools that look like this:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-3-in-C ... /100062306

Big thing for me is, how do you know when to adjust the rigging? Went to the fuel dock the other day and the attendant grabbed my rigging and said it was way too loose.
How much play should be there and how do I know when to adjust? Don't really care if effects sailing peformance, just want it to be safe.

Paulieb

[BOAT]

How much play should be there

None!

[Paulieb]

Really!? So they should be like guitar strings?

[BOAT]

If your playing a flat wound Gibson Byrdland yeah, I guess that might be stiff enough but if we're talking a stock Strat or Les Paul, no way - WAY too loose.

[DaveC426913]

But to your issue, I'd suggest you cut the forestay loose using the MRS if you have one, back the mast back slightly, adjust some predetermined amount, and put the mast back and check. Rinse. Repeat as needed.

I'd rather not release the forestay if I don't have to. Not until I also figure out a winching system to crank it those last two inches. It's really hard to do.

There are also tools you can use, under load, made from a Vice Grip. Lotta force possible with Vice Grips. And there are other methods, too, including a simple tool with a pair of pins to engage the male and female portion and apply force.

Yeah, this what what I was envisioning.

Some late boats came with an adjuster. It can easily be made. A metal pipe or bar with a couple 3/16 machine bolts for pins. Put one pin in the shroud adjuster you want to change and the other in the shroud you're not. That will give you leverage off the fixed and attached shroud. Ie. To adjust the upper put a pin from your tool into the adjuster on the lower shroud for a fixed pivot point.

Hey that's brilliant! Of course! That's what I'm going to do!

If you must do this with the mast up you can also use a piece of wood stick with two screws in it. (I'm surprised any of the older boats have these - I would have figured you guys all for turnbuckles).

It is practical to replace Johnsons with turnbuckles? They'd have to be the right length, and the adjusters would have to be detachable. I can't remember if they are. 'course turnbuckles aren;t nearly as strong as Johnsons....

Really!? So they should be like guitar strings?

Well, yeah. Most standing rigging is supposed to be under tension to approximately 10% of its breaking strength. It's a couple hundred pounds.

[Catigale]

Whipsyjac wrote:
Some late boats came with an adjuster. It can easily be made. A metal pipe or bar with a couple 3/16 machine bolts for pins. Put one pin in the shroud adjuster you want to change and the other in the shroud you're not. That will give you leverage off the fixed and attached shroud. Ie. To adjust the upper put a pin from your tool into the adjuster on the lower shroud for a fixed pivot point.

That's the trick. You can also mark with sharpie as you tighten so you don't lose track.

If you trailer, you don't want to to replace the vernier adjusters with turnbuckles. The vernier are much stronger with regard to twist and will get damaged trailering. This does not bode well sailing, especially for the uppers under 300-400# tension.

[Freedom77]

I agree with Tkanzler. I found the best way to adjust the shrouds is to tie the jib halyard to a bow cleat, release the forestay and tilt the mast back a little. Then adjust your Johnson . It may take a couple of tries but it's easier than trying to muscle the holes into alignment. Fair Winds and Full Sails...Old Salt

[raycarlson]

I went the 10" turnbuckle on front wire, much easier to do any rigging and setup and take down.Plus raised genoa up afoot or so for better forward visability. No negatives detected yet.

[DaveC426913]

...release the forestay ...

Again, don't have a practical solution for that yet. Reattaching the forestay is by far the hardest thing to do on my Mac. It falls about an inch short, and needs 2 strong people to stretch it that last inch to re-pin it.

[DaveC426913]

I went the 10" turnbuckle on front wire, much easier to do any rigging and setup and take down.Plus raised genoa up afoot or so for better forward visability. No negatives detected yet.

How did you do that? Did you raise the head block 10" on the mast? I'd like to put a Johnson lever in my forestay but there's no room at top or bottom of my furler.

[mikedoz1]

I changed the backstage to an adjustable backstage, made my life so much easier when rigging the boat to sail, and I can adjust the mast easily by just pulling on the rope . Would also help ease the shrouds for adjusting.