Super Sport Marine

A forum for discussing issues relating to trailers and towing MacGregor sailboats.
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Tomfoolery
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Sailboat: MacGregor 26X
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by Tomfoolery »

BOAT wrote: Tue May 12, 2020 2:21 pmOnly the pros can weld aluminum (I am told).
Not exactly true. It's not hard to learn to weld aluminium, but if you're considering doing structural work like the trailer beams, I'd leave that to the pros. Not much different than structural steel welding in that if it's a critical weld, a good looking weld can be weak, have inclusions, voids, lack penetration (cold weld), etc. and come apart on you on the road.

When I've done those welds, I've had one of the guys in our shop (AISC shop) do the welding. Something that can be overdesigned or have an overspecified weld, I'll do myself. Like repairs to the goal posts, or bracketry for bunks. But if a full-penetration beam splice was needed, where the trailer frame would break in half on the road if a crack started, I'd have a pro do it. I know my limitations, especially since I'm surrounded by those without those limitations. :wink:

Aluminium has the added bear trap of no fatigue limit, which means that unlike steel, there is no stress level below which fatigue will never occur. Welding increases the stress at the weld interface (stress concentration or stress raiser) and changes the metal in the area outside the weld (heat affected zone, or HAZ), so you have to design for that if it's something that will experience repeated stress. Like a trailer. :| :|

But AFAIK, the Mac trailer as well as most other aluminium trailers don't have many (if any) welded features on the beams, and simply bolt the axles, tongue, and other structural parts onto them.
Tom
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BOAT
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by BOAT »

I understand your issues with projects that are not boat related. I have spent the past 2 years restoring our van motorhome. It's been like building a house; no, like an airplane because everything is lightweight, but stronger. Even on that project the whole thing started because of steel that rusted in the roof. I had the professionals take care of welding that steel and stuff. I always use the pros when it comes to welding because I can't weld. Anyone who thinks I did okay on the mods on boat would be blown away by the mods I did on the van, (electric gas water heaters with bypass and engine boost heat - diesel fired heaters - all solar refrigeration and hybrid air conditioning - hi speed internet with full navigation and GPS - 360 camera system - wireless camera for trailer towing - expanded off road equipment and suspension - and it goes on and on, but this is not a van site - it's a boat site. All I can say is that a lot of the stuff I invented for the van will eventually end up in the boat and you guys can see the stuff then. One thing that you will see in 'boat' soon is 2 part epoxy finish replacing all the varnish. I have got pretty good with 2 part epoxy and a blow torch now. The wood panels in the van look like glass - Just wait till I start on the joinery in 'boat'.
Dreamcatcher
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 7:13 am
Sailboat: MacGregor 26X

Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by Dreamcatcher »

Thanks for the info, people. Although my original question seems to have begun a thread that has devolved into a discussion about re-welding the original steel trailer, you did answer my inquiry. Having no welding equipment, skills, or the time to acquire such, I am going ahead with the aluminum trailer. By this time next month, I should have an original X trailer for any of you welders in the Northeast to buy and play with.
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BOAT
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by BOAT »

Dreamcatcher wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 7:22 am Thanks for the info, people. Although my original question seems to have begun a thread that has devolved into a discussion about re-welding the original steel trailer, you did answer my inquiry. Having no welding equipment, skills, or the time to acquire such, I am going ahead with the aluminum trailer. By this time next month, I should have an original X trailer for any of you welders in the Northeast to buy and play with.
The guy who made all the trailers at the factory was a guy named Clay. He was really nice and very knowledgeable. He would bend the aluminum 'Ibeams' (sp?) there at the factory and his guys would bolt all the stuff together. I do not know if they did the welding at the factory - my assumption is that Roger had welding fabrication jobbed out.

Clay moved to Florida with the Sharps. If we could find Clay and and what he is up to these days we could ask him about the trailers that are being offered from Super Sport Marine. I really like the factory design - it's simple and easy to maintain. I wish we knew where Clay the trailer guy is.

If I had Clay I think I could start a company that builds the trailers in like three weeks - Clay knew everything. At $1400 a pop I think we could make about one trailer per day working part time at a cost of about 550 dollars for single axle. That's 20 grand per month profit easy working maybe 2 weeks per month for two guys.

Boat trailers are too expensive these days.
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Tomfoolery
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by Tomfoolery »

BOAT wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 9:30 amHe would bend the aluminum 'Ibeams' (sp?) there at the factory and his guys would bolt all the stuff together.
Well, sort of. That section is technically called "Aluminum Association", which has flanges of constant thickness similar to wide-flange steel beams (W-section), as opposed to American Standard, which is similar to the old S-section steel beams (standard section, with tapered flanges - the original I-beams).

And there's a typo in the archived material spec. on suppliers corner page.

https://macgregorsailors.com/resources/ ... ebsite.pdf

The web dimension should read .190", not .109". It should say 3.5 x 5 x .320 flange x .190 web. It's a standard commercially available beam at around $450 each these days for 25 ft. In case someone wants to build their own. :wink:
Tom
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1st Sail
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by 1st Sail »

I priced a second leaf spring axle assembly from UFP (oem supplier) a few years back. $650+ sans freight, rims, tires.
:macm:
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Herschel
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by Herschel »

Dreamcatcher wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 7:22 am Thanks for the info, people. Although my original question seems to have begun a thread that has devolved into a discussion about re-welding the original steel trailer, you did answer my inquiry. Having no welding equipment, skills, or the time to acquire such, I am going ahead with the aluminum trailer. By this time next month, I should have an original X trailer for any of you welders in the Northeast to buy and play with.
No, thanks. I've got all of those kind of "toys" I want already. :D
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Herschel
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Re: Super Sport Marine

Post by Herschel »

BOAT wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 6:42 am I understand your issues with projects that are not boat related. I have spent the past 2 years restoring our van motorhome. It's been like building a house; no, like an airplane because everything is lightweight, but stronger. Even on that project the whole thing started because of steel that rusted in the roof. I had the professionals take care of welding that steel and stuff. I always use the pros when it comes to welding because I can't weld. Anyone who thinks I did okay on the mods on boat would be blown away by the mods I did on the van, (electric gas water heaters with bypass and engine boost heat - diesel fired heaters - all solar refrigeration and hybrid air conditioning - hi speed internet with full navigation and GPS - 360 camera system - wireless camera for trailer towing - expanded off road equipment and suspension - and it goes on and on, but this is not a van site - it's a boat site. All I can say is that a lot of the stuff I invented for the van will eventually end up in the boat and you guys can see the stuff then. One thing that you will see in 'boat' soon is 2 part epoxy finish replacing all the varnish. I have got pretty good with 2 part epoxy and a blow torch now. The wood panels in the van look like glass - Just wait till I start on the joinery in 'boat'.
That is really cool, Boat. I have put off my plans for an RV trip to California from this summer until 2021. Maybe you can give me tour of that puppy next year.
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