Engine Hours

[David Hampson]

I am looking at buying my first Mac 26X here in the UK. There are currently 2 for sale locally both with Yamaha 50HP 4 stroke. A 2000 model with 150 hours and a 2002 with 100 hours.
My question is what is classed as "High Mileage" in outboard motor terms.
My second question is what is the life expectancy of an engine, and what signs should I be looking for to see if the engine has been abused.

[jetta01]

I have heard 600 to 800 with no problem, but I just saw another web site that said "The typical life span can be anywhere from 800-1200 hours." Sounds like either of those engine options are in the low use range.

[Dimitri-2000X-Tampa]

I would guess you could get even more hours than that...like perhaps over 2000 provided its properly maintained of course.

[MarkStanton]

David,

(And any other UK members who are not already members)

You may find the UK MacGregor Owners Association useful, as well as a magazine, and regular rallys they maintain a list of Macs for sail, spares, a UK Mac Compatibile slipway directory and have a host of UK specific advice.

Let me know if you want their contact details.

They have an internal members only website for discussion but their external web prescence is sadly lacking. But is on my to do list for this winter

Regards, Mark

[msshene]

I would certainly hope you would get well over 1000 hrs. I have a Honda Eu6000 2 cylinder liquid cooler generator that is 15 years old with 5900 hrs. on it and it still runs fine, knock on wood. That is the main reason I bought the Honda BF50 outboard for the Macgregor. The BF50 is a 3 cylinder liquid cooled engine. I have heard 6000hrs for gas engines and 9-12000 for deisels. Sounds like the generator is very near the end. I change the oil ever 100 hrs. on the generator and have had just a few problems with it. I change the oil in the BF50 at the end of ever season, as I only put 25-35 hours per year on it. Always though it was best to change it in the fall rather than spring to get any acids that might have found its way into the oil from the combustion process. I drain and refill the lower end to verify clear fluid(no water) and refill with new. Real cheap and easy to do as I see it. To me the two boats you are considering would have very similar engines, I would base my decision on other factors such as options, hull/sail, trailer condition. Best of luck, Mike

[argonaut]

Yammies are good motors and sound like a draw as far as running hours, both are low. (150 hrs/3 yrs=50 hrs/year... about an hour a week.)

Now abuse... see if they'll let you examine the motor, don't be bashful as this is a huge fraction of the boat's value.

Show up with a plug wrench & check:
o Engine oil color... golden or black (ever changed)?
o Oil filter... original?
o Fuel filter... original?
o Pull a plug... nice & tan or icky?
o Lower unit lube... fluid look translucent (good), or like chocolate milk (bad)?
o Prop... chewed up or like new?

You're trying to see if the motor's been maintained.

Run in water PLEASE... if you can to see that it starts and observe:
o OB pees as it should on start (cooling system works)
o the engine at least idles... so there's probably compression.

A sea trial would demonstrate that the engine works in all power ranges. If willing to do that for you, you have an idea the seller's not hiding a lemon. Just a short hop out and back to see the engine go through it's power ranges. A valueable test.

A compression test on all cylinders is sort of a mechanic's EKG and can indicate abuse like running overtemp or lube problems. If he lets you do (or a mechanic you've compensated accordingly) do this it's a good sign.

Beyond that it's you and the man upstairs, you've done your homework.
Properly maintained, with good compression, running smoothly and properly in the water, that motor could last a very long time, at least as previously stated thousands of hours.

Thankfully, _not_ being a Honda, you at least -can- get it repaired if it breaks and parts are plentiful. Welcome to the club David, these boats are fun as hedoubletoothpicks. I seldom use my 50 for much more than getting in & out of a slip but it's nice to have if you need it.

[Terry]

Hours?
For a 4 stroke Honda? Well, compared to a car I have to wonder. Lets see, 1/2 hour each way to work and back for 5 hours a week, plus an hour or more on weekends for a total of 6 hours. Omit those long Sunday drives and vacation drives for now. At 6 hours a week times 52 weeks that's 312 hours a year times 10 years for over 3000 hours, but we all know that is a conservatively low geusstimate.
Now, back to the outboard, is it not reasonable to expect similar endurance for a 4 stroke outboard? I mean really, I had a 4 stroke 4 cylinder motorcycle that had more time than that on it and I only drove it on sunny days, but then I always searched out tours to go on just for the fun of it. What if the engine is on a power boat, one would really rack up the hours then. Considering how much a 50 HP engine costs I would hope to expect 2-3000 hours from it. Am I asking to much?

[bill barchard]

The average boater uses the engine 200 hours a year. On the west cost of BC the winds are not steady so most sailbats run engine 80% of the time.
2 cycle engins were built to run 1850 hours or so.
The Honda 50 is very proven and is known to run 5000 Hours
On the newer design engins I have no idea.

[Robert]

IMHO, The definition of highway miles for an outboard motor are when running the outboard after it is warmed up, a steady speed for a long time, and to do this very frequently, the highway miles motor will have the optimum pitch prop on it because for the frequent user, concerned about the longevity of the outboard, the correct prop pitch will be important. The "City Miles" for an outboard would be running it a short time and never even up to half throttle just to get out where the sails can take over, not letting the motor get fully warmed up, not getting the correct propeller etc.. The City miles outboard user will have the default prop on there, not wanting to bother about performance, since they only put put out to the sailing area.
..
I don't mean to say that a "sailing mostly" owner does not take care of their outboard, they probably do take great care, only that they may depend mostly on sails and view the outboard as secondary or not very necessary and so don't pay too much attention to it. Sailing shops might not be very interested in the motor performance either.
..
Ask each boat owner to tell you the outboard service shop they use. With the owner's permission you can ask the outboard shop for the service records and engine history.
..
Asuming that hours on an outboard at cruise are like those on a car at cruise and assuming each hour is worth 50 miles on average, the 5000 hour 4 stroke is like 250,000 miles vs. the two stroke 1850 hours is like 92,500 miles and that sounds about right to me. I have no experience wearing out outboards, but I think it is fair to assume the outboard to last several decades for recreational use if maintained.

[Terry]

The "City Miles" for an outboard would be running it a short time and never even up to half throttle just to get out where the sails can take over, not letting the motor get fully warmed up, not getting the correct propeller etc.. The City miles outboard user will have the default prop on there, not wanting to bother about performance, since they only put put out to the sailing area.

don't mean to say that a "sailing mostly" owner does not take care of their outboard, they probably do take great care, only that they may depend mostly on sails and view the outboard as secondary or not very necessary and so don't pay too much attention to it.

This may be true for the purebred sailboat that uses a 9.9 HP or smaller but many Mac owners myself included care very much about optimum diameter and pitch and getting a proper match. We also depend on the motor more than the sails when going on extended overnight trips. The beauty of a powersailor is having it both ways. There is a group of us that go on several planned trips anually and we mostly power to our destination then sail once we get there.
Perhaps for day sailing the motor becomes secondary but even then when the winds die off the engine gets turned on. I suspect on the Macs that the engine is far less secondary than it is with the pure sailboats.

[Chip Hindes]

IMHO, The definition of highway miles for an outboard motor are when running the outboard after it is warmed up, a steady speed for a long time, and to do this very frequently,

It's certainly not recommended to start and run a motor for short time, and never let it get warmed up to full operating temperature. However, once your motor has done so, running it for any amount of time at any speed results in additional wear, period.

I'm not saying an hour of constant starts and stops is not worse than an hour of operation at constant speed. cold starts are obviously the worst. However, it almost appears you're saying running it is better than not running it, and that's simply not the case. If that's not what you're saying, please clarify.

I don't believe it's ever recommended to run any motor at constant speed and load for extended periods. On an automobile accumulating highway miles, this happens naturally. Hill climbs, a little slower, a little faster, occasional downshifts and upshifts, overruns on the downhill side, etcetera are the key to longest engine life. On a boat with a hand throttle, you have to make a conscious effort to do these things. Vary your speeds. Once in awhile, moderate acceleration to load it up a little, then let it coast down. Hole shots are bad, but a full throttle run for a few minutes once in awhile to blow out the carbon is the ticket. Never shut it down immediately after a full throttle run. Let it cool down a few minutes at idle, or better, at part throttle ahead.

[Robert]

I did not mean to imply that more hours are less wear at all. Just that for a motor with high hours I'd rather have one that ran long enough to thouroughly warm up each startup and had fewer startups than one with a lot of on and off.
..