Adding ballast to center board

[26XSunsailrs]

Hello fellow Mac26Xers,

I've sailed our 26X for about four years now and still love it. I find myself looking at other boats however for a couple of reasons. I would like more room (for storage also) and more stability under sail. My first mate is constantly nervous in larger winds due to the amount of heel necessary before the water ballast effect kicks in. I think the boat would sail faster also if you could leave the larger sheets up in relatively stronger winds.

I believe this topic has been discussed, but I could not find it posted. I am considering modifying or replacing the center board to put some ballast in it. From some rough calculations, I think even 50 lbs. on the end of the CB would equate to another two average sized people sitting on the seats. My calculations made the "moment" a 7::1 ratio. The advantage would be that it would begin its ballast effect at even slight degrees of heel.

The concern of course is if you add weight to the CB, how will you raise it? I am considering creating a hole at the end of the CB trunk and extending it with an attached tube above the water line (similar to the mast support now). I would run the line to the CB from the other end of the trunk to gain tremendous mechanical advantage compared to the factory set up. The drag produced by the line in the down position would have to be considered though.

I even have modification "illusions of grandeur" of creating a dagger board set up for the CB and filling the rest of the unused trunk with ballast. The additional weight would be next to nothing compared to the junk I haul inside the cabin during trailering. The mechanical advantage of hanging 4 feet below the hull would be lost in this scenario though.

Has anyone done any research or tried anything to add some ballast under sail? This would be a major modification, but considering the price of other, faster sailing vessels it would be worth the time and some money to avoid moving to another boat.

I'll put my other major modification idea for storage on a different post.

Thanks for any input!

-Steve Mac26X Together

[Steve K]

Check how older trailerables were set up.
The Catalina 22 and, I think, the older Mac/Ventures have a weighted keel. They have a tube, like you suggest that a keel lifting cable runs through, to well above the waterline. In the case of the Catalina, there was a winch, much like the winch on the front of your trailer, for lifting up the 550 pound swing keel.
As I said, the winch looked like a regular trailer winch, but it is not. It is known as a "brake" winch. Rather than a lever, it has a built in clutch. This is a safety feature so the handle won't get away from you and fly around.
The winch was mounted right below the companionway in the C 22, which put the cable attachment low, on the rear of the keel.

As far as the cable itself goes, I don't thing it caused a lot of drag. I do remember if I left the keel down, but had the cable still tight it would start to sing like a bass fiddle.

Anyway, I'm sure you can do some googling on the net and get some kind of pictures, or diagrams of these keel lifting setups.
SK

[bscott]

I modified the CB on a Hunter 22 which stock was unweighted but weighed about 120#. I installed about 50# of lead in the bottom of the CB and installed a brass bushing in the CB to handle the additional weight.

In order to raise the weighted board from the cockpit, I increased the purchase to a 4:1 pulley system.

Results: The boat did stiffen up considerably which improved pointing and lessened weather helm.

AS a side note, raising the CB in heavy weather reduces weather helm because the reduced lift of the CB allows the boat to side slip, thus reducing healing----pointing, however, is reduced.

Since I sail with a limited crew, it is imperative that the CB be trimed from the helm.

[Rolf]

I just changed cb rope, and when crawling around under there, I could've sworn Cb was hollow and had a couple of holes for taking in ballast. Can anyone confirm this?
Rolf

[Captain Steve]

Thats correct....it takes a bit of time to fill when you drop it.

[Schock Therapy]

A hollow centerboard with holes?? PERFECT! Just fill that puppy with lead shot and seal it up!

[Schock Therapy]

Then you can say you sail a "leadmine" just like me! Careful tho; Frank M might just loose it completely and go postal on ya!

[craiglaforce]

I recall a few people wanting to do something similar to their 26x's a few years ago. They were talking about modest amounts of lead shot (10 lbs or less) mainly to help the board drop if I recall.

As I understand your description about a tube, I assume you are talking about something like another compression post mounted on top of the centerboard slot aft part. Then put a turning block at the deck and bring it back to a small dedicated winch

Just a couple of cautions:
1) the CB hanger hardware does not strike me as being overdesigned.
2) the pivot hole was defective on a number of centerboards (it is not supposed to be hollow there) and was wearing the hole much larger. Some added a home-made bushing fashioned from a short piece of copper pipe bonded into the hole.
3) if you hit ground with a lead shot filled centerboard, the wear or damage on the bottom of the centerboard will be greater. Don't know how much worse it would be, but something to consider.
4) dropping the board for routnine inspection, repair, bottom painting will become a bit more difficult depending upon how much weight you add.
5) when motoring high speed and no water ballast, will the heavier board survive the hull pounding?

Have you reviewed where your ballast is stored already? you might gain some stability by just locating a couple of big batteries down against the centerboard well internally, like under the aft dinette seat. I just put one down there and I bet it will help.

Another option would be to just buy a steel centerboard custom made to fit in there. That would keep this mod from being a one way trip.

Good luck and let us know how it works out if you try it. Not trying to discourage you, but just provide a list of what I would consider to give you the best chance of success..

[Joe 26M Time Warp]

I think we touched on this subject last summer. As usual, for me the question was regarding the M and it's dagger board.

I agree Steve Sunsailors, that a small amount of weight added to the end of the board might be just the ticket. 50 to 100 lbs on the end of the lever arm when fully extended might have the same effect as adding many times that weight in water ballast.

While the straight pull required on the M's dagger could be strengthened by using a steel cable, the X version needs to take the pivot into account. Besides considering the static weight bearing pivot, you might want to closely examine the angle of the cable pull and its relation to the pivot.

Craig's #3. The concern about grounding and losing some of the X kick-up CB survivability feature I think is a minimum issue. After all, many if not most boaters are very concerned about hitting the bottom under any circumstance, and obviously we daggerboarders are no different.

[bscott]

You must add a metal bushing to the CB pivot hole as the extra weight will definately hollow out the hole and fail. I used brass oar locks which I reemed out to fit the shaft. I then epoxied and thru bolted the flanges together creating a continuous bushing. I think brass will hold up the best in salt water, however, this area must be inspected often. Catalina 22s are prone to dropping their CB because of their heavy weight pivot problems.

The best way to add lead is to get lead shot, mix it with epoxy and pour into the holes. This will seal itself and you can grind a smooth surface. I forgot to add the weight of the epoxy into the formula so I added more weight than planned,

Used T-900 Spectra, 6 mm (4400 lbs breaking strength) as a replacement line.

[craiglaforce]

How much weight did you end up adding? Did it help?

Did you mean to say Brass or Bronze? Bronze is awesome in salt water, brass will cause problems I think. Brass has a lot of zinc in it which sacrifices itself quickly to the corrosion demons leaving behind a de-zinc-ified, failed mess.

[Dimitri-2000X-Tampa]

I would be concerned that the whole pivot pin assembly on a 26X wasn't designed for the extra weight and may be prone to more rapid failure. I'm getting ready to inspect mine now that the boat is 4.5 years old. The pin was somewhat corroded the last time I looked at it. I expect that this is something that may need to be replaced every 5 years or so.

[sailpsych]

The idea of adding additional righting moment to the boat is a great idea. Lets take it one thought further.

What if the hull were modified so that a wing on the bottom of the CB, when retracted, would slide back up into the hull? So basically the CB slot on the bottom would be a "T." The wing would provide additional sea-keeping ability while also providing additonal righting moment. Wouldn't have to be much of a wing to provide enormous additional stability.

Or a hinged-retracting wing that collapses and swings up on either side of the CB when retracted into the hull and is forced open by a separate line when you want to "deploy" the wing.

The down side is, increased drag when motoring (or sailing for that matter), and increased susceptability to capsize when motoring if it "accidentally" deploys. Come to think of it, if you got going fast enough with the wing down, you would have a hydro-foil.

Bruce

[bscott]

Craig---I did use bronze oar locks---you are correct. After reeming them out, I pressed them into a bronze tube with the flanges facing out. I then epoxied the unit into the CB and thru bolted the flanges together, I don't think this will ever come apart. I think the additional weight was probably about 55 lbs complete with oarlocks, epoxy and lead shot. I don't think I'd go that heavy the next time---maybe start with 20 lbs and add from there.

Yes, I could tell a difference in stability---can't say much about speed 'cause I don't have a gps and the paddle wheel is not accurate enough.

[craiglaforce]

Thanks for the follow-up. Sounds like you did a great job with it. I've got to believe it improved your speed and comfort quite a bit.
I know what you mean about those paddle wheels. I had one attached to my depth finder. Never worked right. THis spring I broke the wheel off and attached the sounder inside my hull with some goop. much cleaner arrangment.

I've always sort of fantisized about a 200 lb weight on a hinged spar that I could swing to extend about 4 feet beyond the high side every time I tacked. Sort of artificial harness meat.