Steering - works but not under "stress"

[WidespreadSailing]

So here goes another steering issue...

I have a 96X with a 'newer' morse cable and teleflex steering system.

The steering wheel turns both ways perfect at the dock. Once I get any pressure on the rudders/motor I can turn the wheel fine to the left but then I have to 'assist' with turning it to the right. Also another note... When this occurs I try and turn the wheel and it starts making a clicking sound. The noise is coming from the steering system area.

By assist I mean grab the engine and "help" it - by pushing it from port to starboard.
By Pressure on the rudders I mean when sailing or currents. etc.

All other things work and function perfectly. (Except when there is pressure on the rudders - motor.)

I have scoured the internet and everyone talks about their Cable breaking.... Mine never broke - it just doesn't work with any force applied to the rudders/engine.




Any thoughts...

[Boblee]

Mine on the works fine but have a teleflex on a polyboat and it's pretty much as you describe or was, it is still not good but I did do some pretty serious lubricating at both ends but still feel the motor end which is not fully accessible has an ongoing problem especially under pressure.
Will be just replacing it when I replace the motor as it is IMHO a safety issue with that boat if the cable snaps at speed interestingly took the boat to a dealer and he said it was normal
The without the motor hooked up is so free the rudders move in the wind and fingertip control on the water

[c130king]

WSW,

Sounds like maybe your steering cable is corroding or sticking. The noise you are hearing could be your rack & pinion gears inside your steering column slipping/grinding.

You could turn the wheel full left (or maybe right) and get as much of your steering cable exposed as possible (the cable will slide out of the plastic covering). Lube this up with some sort of marine grease. Then try to turn the wheel back and forth to work your cable in and out of the plastic covering and maybe this will spread the grease around up inside there and make everything start to work smoother.

You can also check your rack and pinion inside the pedastal. Four screws to take it off. Look for broken bits of gears/teeth. Look for grease inside there. Add some more if it looks dried out.

I posted some pics of my cable and rack/pinion in my post from when this happened to me. Search for "Steering Broke" using the advanced search and put my username in the author field. You will find the pics in there.

Good luck.

Cheers,
Jim

[mrbillfll]

I agree, a clicking sound is probably a rack problem below the wheel. the gears are not binding correctly with the cable.

inspect, lube and tighten if needed.

strange that it turns freely at the dock but not at speed... if someone puts resistance on the engine at the dock. same results?

[Retcoastie]

I would suspect the woodruff key in the steering wheel. Sounds to me like the key has sheared and is binding the wheel when there is little load. When the load increases, the wheel is spinning on the shaft and not turning the pinion in the rack.

Good luck, lets us know what you find.

Ken

[vkmaynard]

Sounds like your pinion to rack 4 bolts need to be tightened. Just need a 7/16" socket on a 1/4" drive ratchet. You should use a small amount of "Blue" Locktite on the threads. Happened to me on our steering system while working on our autopilot. I did not pay attention reinstalling all the bolts correctly after AP removal for bench testing. Under load the steering would skip.

Victor

[esc]

I agree, a clicking sound is probably a rack problem below the wheel. the gears are not binding correctly with the cable.

inspect, lube and tighten if needed.

strange that it turns freely at the dock but not at speed... if someone puts resistance on the engine at the dock. same results?

It sounds to me like the teeth inside the helm are worn and slipping. That isn't too far from what mine did before I replaced it earlier this year in my . Except mine only slipped in one place where the outer gear was broken. But if the gear on the axle were worn, I would expect just what was reported.

Here are a bunch of pictures I took while pulling mine out.
http://www.comstockcomputing.com/macgre ... index.html

[vkmaynard]

Did you check out your steering ystem?

[WidespreadSailing]

Had some girl friends in town (somehow this happens a lot more now that I live in Key West). We still made it to the reef on a friends boat.

Finally got myself a large enough socket and a large racket / breaker bar to see if I can't get the wheel off of it today. Will post results tomorrow.

I also have used a wire brush and PB Blaster to hopefully loose up the nut easier.

[WidespreadSailing]

Finally got it loose and took the part to West Marine. I have a steering helm that "actually" has screws on the back so I was able to take it apart. (Most new ones from TeleFlex are riveted and you can't get into them.)

The problem was the less than a $1 plastic piece inside the unit. It is the ONLY piece made out of plastic. It secures the cable against the "grooves" of the cable against the "grooves" of the helm. The left side of mine was "rubbed" enough that it no longer kept the cable in the grooves. Hence the reason it was only a problem on one side and not the other.

Bottom line.... The part is over 10 years old and nowhere to be found on the internet. I called 3 'salvage' places in the Keys and no one had that specific plastic piece.

I am procuring the UFlex model that others have indicated.

Special thanks to ESC. Your write up and pictures were spot on.
http://www.comstockcomputing.com/macgre ... index.html
Thanks. BIG TIME

[esc]

Happy to help.

Check the cable length on yours before ordering a new one. Mine had "144IN" written right on the cable so I have no excuse (other than taking bad advise) for having ordered the wrong length cable. I was lucky in that the vendor I ordered from was willing to swap out the cable for a $10.00 shipping fee.
Let us know how it turns out.


Eric

[Crikey]

Eric, that was one of the nicest, most documented sequences I've ever seen on this board.

That makes a good case for a future Macgregor sailors mod section makeover!

Well done

[esc]

Thanks!

But it is funny you should say so. I was just noticing that I left a few things out so I updated it.

I had not posted the few pictures I took during the re-install, so I added those, included a little more about how I got the wrong length cable at first and modified all the pictures so that clicking on them would give you a full-res version.

The re-install pictures address the length of the "Snout" of the U-Flex, it is considerably longer that the original and requires the new bracket be inverted in order to place the wheel in the correct location.

[claudio]

Hello all!

This weekend I felt what is a failure of the stearing gear. Going inside a Club in Biscayne bay, Wind of almost 25 knots. Everything was going smooth untill I negotiate a sharp turn with wind from the stern and I turn my wheel three hundred times without answer from the rudder and engine.
Manuvering with the engine I could avoid a very bad crash against the berth. Just a crack of 20 inches as a trophy.

I still looking for a new stearing gear cause the one that I bought from the West Marine doesn´t fit inside the place.

Please if some one know where to find it. I would be really thankful.

I have a 26X 1996

[claudio]

Thank you Erick now that I have checked your nice step-by-step.
I already bought the part.

Now I just need to fix the uper hull broken. lol!!!

Claudio