Free Fuel....Well almost!

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Tom Root
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Free Fuel....Well almost!

Post by Tom Root »

I finally made the plunge, I have an F-250 Ford Diesel, and decided to go Greasel, see http://www.greasel.com and have purchased all the filters required to get up and running. It was close to a grand, so no, it's not free, but the grease is, and it will have a payback very quickly!

I was tired of paying from $2.50- $2.80 for diesel, so that was the kicker, I have found resources for up to 200 gallons a week locally, within 6 miles, and collect it in free 55 gallon drums I found from a guy who gives them away. I have 8 so far, and you cook the stuff for 3 to 4 weeks in the sun, filter it, and walla!......free fuel! I am picking up my 1st load today, and will be about 3 weeks till my exhaust smells like french fries. Then everyone behind me will get hungry, I get more grease, and on and on, this completes the cycle! :)

They say it will be over 3 bucks a gallon by mid summer, and I sure wish the best for you over-the-road truckers out there, I don't know how you can do it! Get ready for alot of products to increase drastically soon also, as we consumers have to pay for these increases. It's not all doom and gloom, just run grease! (Note* There is NO diesel I know of that can't be fed by grease, check out the big rig on the link page, that Mack is just the ticket for a long haul with this renewable fuel!)

I may be trading the 1st mates Crown Vicky gasser in on a Mercedes Diesel also, and stuffing a Diesel in my 4X4 too! Gotta cope with all this BS some how!, that's my solution!

Now, if they only made a decent sized and readily available Diesel outboard.....I'd truly be in heaven!
Last edited by Tom Root on Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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craiglaforce
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Post by craiglaforce »

I assume you can still run diesel if you run out of grease?
This is too funny. You have to heat the grease in the sun for a while?

Does the grease have problems in cold weather? ie solidify? This is pretty amazng. Do you think the higher fuel prices are here to stay? I tend to think they will fall back a bit after industry has some time to adjust or add capacity and government lets them drill.
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Craig.
Nope, I'm not laughing, when I put 20 bucks in, and get barely 8 gallons I take note! When 'ol Mr. Diesel designed his engine, in the late 1800's,he ran it on peanut oil actually, and it runs just peachy with this fuel! There are three ways to go, Bio-Diesel, which is as good as Diesel, and needs NO extra filtering , or bother, it is a blend of Diesel and Veggie oil with an alcohol boost to raise Cetane (Similar to Octane in refined gasoline) The second is SVO, (Straight Vegetable Oil)which is which is unrefined veggie oil, and you can filter and mix your own Bio-Diesel, or run as is with a stop and and start of Bio Diesel, or regular Diesel. This can be supplied by obtaining 5 gallon regular unused hydrogenated (better than unhydrogenated, but you can still use this also with a bit of care) And if you have a local producer of cooking oil, they have reduced rates for bulk, and sometimes contaminated oil. (cannot be used for cooking food for various reasons)

The Third, which I am doing is WVO (Waste Vegatable Oil) which is the stuff that restaurants throw away, and pay to have hauled away! (Or they gladly give to me!) This must be filtered to at least .10 micron via several filters, and again, unless you blend to make BioDiesel, run it as-is! Again it must be heated via a heater line jacket that parallels the fuel supply line, and in the tank, to approx 170 degrees so that it doesn't gel.This only seems to be a concern in temps which are say 50 or so degrees, and we have so few of those here, but I am plumbing this in also! It must settle in my black painted drums, and cook for a few weeks to have a better viscosity! Mexican and Asian food restaurants are the biggest producers of waste, BTW.

I am doing this for two reasons, one is that I am just doing my part to use a renewable resource vice a finite one such as Dinosaur blood, and because I truly want to relize savings in the long haul, so it becomes an economical and viable solution to be more "Green" because this stuff really does "close the loop" on the carbon atom, as it has very little pollutants and claims of better lubrication for the fuel system, no coking, and longer engine life, by 30% ! That means I get 400K + miles out of this mill, before overhaul,and by that time, the truck should truly fall apart before the engine!

So, yes, it's been a consideration for quite some time, it is not easy, but I am commited at this point for various reasons, and resolved to doing my part to save this 3rd rock from the sun, with relative little loss of capabilities. We do not have a mass transit system that works in California, and carpooling may work for some, this way I am saving in many ways! It remains to be seen, but I feel OPEC may pull a fast one and who knows, put a strangle hold on us, and stop the flow, like was done in '73. No crystal ball here, but I see the writing on the wall, so to speak! I was in Marine basic training, during that debacle, but was told how bad it got. Can we see a repeat? Yes, IMHO, and I'll be ready!

If I had the means, I'd add solar to the roof of my house, and a windmill also. I did convince my next door neighbor, who just happened to be on a daysail on our X one day, who mentioned that he was going to redo his pool with his refinance. I mentioned that he'd be better off buying solar. He did and now his average $800.00 a month electric bill, has dwindled to about $50.00, after he added over 60 panels (120 watt modules) to his roof! He works as an engineer at a local power plant ironically, and had the government help pay for his 80 thousand dollar system, they paid half!

And you guys are "green" also by owning a sail boat, you are doing your part, whether or not you are meaning to, you are helping free our great nation from the bonds of energy dependance, and a system, which is out of control. My opinion, anyway.......so yes I am serious, and will gladly make sacrifices for the better good. And save some big bucks in the long run! Then I can afford more toys for the Mac!!!!!!!! :)
Last edited by Tom Root on Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Chip Hindes
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Post by Chip Hindes »

Tom wrote:one is that I am just doing my part to use a renewable resource vice a finite one such as Dinosaur blood
Now you've gone a struck a nerve.

Waste vegetable oil is a worthwhile exercise only when otherwise it would be thrown away.

On the other hand, pure vegetable is only considered a truly renewable resource to those who are trying to sell it. In truth, like ethanol, vegetable oil is way worse than simply not renewable, because it takes more than one gallon equivalent of some other fuel: gasoline, diesel, fuel oil, natural gas, coal or electricity (usually a combination of all the above, and all of which can be traced back to "dinosaur blood") to produce a gallon of vegetable oil.
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Hey Chip, I certainly am not wanting to pi$$ anyone off by this post, just passing along some good gouge on fueling your tow vehicle, or otherwise. You have a point, it still requires energy, to make Veggie Oil initialy, and I did state I am going the Waste route, have I not? As far as taking more fuel to produce Veggie Oil, gallon per gallon, and the stuff is still a bit cheaper than fuel at the pump, I believe you may be on to something. As the Veggie Oil industry is deeply subsidized by your federal tax dollars, as is Corn sugar, used extensivly as a cane sugar substitute in the last several decades. This is the main ingredient in Gasohol of course too! I say we make more Nuke plants, and take the spent fuel rods and dump them in Isreal....just joking, on that one....really! :)

That's why I think I am doing my part....peace!!!!!! :wink:

Or better yet, Imagine whirrled peas.... :P
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craiglaforce
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Post by craiglaforce »

Thanks for the "food for thought" . I hadn't really followed this new technology before. I guess it sure beats tossing the grease in a landfill soemwhere.

I keep waiting for nuclear fusion to come along and save our butts, but maybe instead we will go back to horses and sailboats.

Chip actually has a good point that often gets overlooked in some new technologies like hydrogen for example. They keep saying how pollution free a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle is, but never mention that hydrogen had to be produced by burning petroluem somewhere, and between the partial oxidation, purification via molecular sieves, and wildly expensive and energy intensive compression of H2 to 2000 psi, probably uses more fuel per mile than a conventional engine and certainly requires a huge capital investment. This is one area where a free market actually inspires the correct decisions. Cheaper generally means more efficient overall since resources cost money. The only resource that is free is air (so far).

Interesting topic. Thanks
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Chip Hindes
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Post by Chip Hindes »

Tom wrote:Hey Chip, I certainly am not wanting to pi$$ anyone off by this post, just passing along some good gouge on fueling your tow vehicle, or otherwise.
Sorry Tom, didn't mean to come off so strongly. It appears you have a good plan; the use of waste veg oil is fine, although it seems pretty messy. But it's also not really renewable in that you can't simply grow more, as some its proponents keep saying.

It's misleading in the same way electric vehicles being called "zero emissions" is misleading. The problem is, there are a lot of hucksters out there making big money on this, in part by misleading conscientious people into thinking they're saving the environment. It's simply not so.

BTW, those "systems" being sold by the Greasel people consist of a few valves, some fuel line and standard, off the shelf Tempo plastic marine gasoline tanks Tempo tanks The 6.5 gallon system that sells for $365 from Greasel is a couple of valves, fuel line, a tank which retails at $27 tank from West Marine; and maybe some really expensive zip ties. The markup appears to be spectacular.
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Chip, I agree, their markup on some items are over the edge, but I did try and get some items they sell at other sources and it was almost impossible to obtain anywhere else! I did purchase the Racor LFS series reusable (Cleanable) screen from a boat parts house in Lousianna on line and thought their advertised price was lower than Greasel. It turns out that the manufacturer has only packaged a the .30 micron screen filter, and what is needed was a .10 micron. so, I ended up spending 5 bucks less than Greasel, so their wasn't too big of a differance. Plus, their voice helpline is awesome and they are willing to spend as much time with you for questions, as you need, and can answer most questions by refering to their already posted Q&A section online. I am willing to spend a bit more for SERVICE, which I will commend them on HIGHLY! It can be a pain sometimes to get through by voice sometimes, as they are busy now for obvious reasons. But Email replies are possible also! So as far as value, their experience in this setup and use of their proven and developing designs are beyond compare! I have found them to be both proffesional and personable, and would reccomend any of their products due to my experience with them!

If someone out there was resourceful enough, they could could find some items cheaper....possibly. but try and get some of their items and you get frustrated real quick, the general public does not have access to most items easily, at least I have found!

As far as hucksters, and carpet baggers, yes there are those too, but a place I use as resources also is http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/6/ubb.x?a=cfrm&s=447609751 It is a friendly and informative forum, that allows a novice such as myself to ask questions, and get informed, just like this Heath's site here!

I consider it renewable, as the research I have done leads me to believe the renderers who collect this stuff merely dump it all away in pits. I would like to see it reused instead of wasted! It is truly renewable in that we can grow more veggies, and yes it is labor intensive and consumes energy to produce. There is also a limited amount available also, because demand would eventually outstrip supply!


I just wanted to inform others of this option, it may or may not work out for me! I pumped free grease yesterday with few hassles and mess, but time will tell if this is viable, many are very happy if they are commited to doing a bit of work to make it happen!One of the owners is heading out west and stopping by my place later this month, he has a Diesel Motorhome, and a Diesel pickup (Dodge Cummins) and will be stoppping by his many customers places, and didn't ask, but I and many others are offering Greasel for his fuel.

It is a very cooperative community, much like the sailing community, specifically our Mac community. I have given free rides all the time, and want others involved in our great sport, so I try and spread the gospel of our great endeavor whenever I can. I have seen many friends change from the powerboat community over the years by having been given the opportunity to experience the thrill and excitement of sailing! And even though we all know the wind is free, boat stuff isn't, but a more reasonable expendature in my opinion than a power boat. Somehow I am trying to tie the same logic in this endeavor, (Home brew fuel) as being a bit more ecologically responsible. And until we get more viable alternate modes of transportation, we have a very narrow spectrum to work with!

People may think I am truly foolish in this endeavor, that's their perogative, but someone else may see it's merits, and take advantage of something that can work for them also! Sorry if I am long winded, or boring you guys and gals out there, but I guess we all get passionate on some things :!:

BTW.........Chip, I really do appreciate you being the devil's advocate in this thread, it does bring perspective into the discussion which can enhance knowledge for all of us, so thanks! :wink:
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Also, to add a bit more info in my setup! I already have a dual tank arraingement, so I do not really need an additional tank, and 5 gallons just wouldn't seem worth the bother! So purchased the tankless kit that Greasel.com offers. In my particular circumstance I have to stop and start the engine fed on Diesel, or Bio-Diesel, so the plumbing and fuel injector pump and injectors stay unclogged. I am adding a tank behind my seat, from a '73 Ford, and that will be heated also, and give me extended range with grease. I may even add an additional tank on the passenger side, and where the spare tire now resides and mount that in the grille. I have always owned a pickup for it's versatility,(And a motorcycle along with a fuel miser car) and have a fully self contained 10 1/2' cabover camper and a 40' 5th wheel RV, several boats, uhhh, yea too many toys, huh? So the in- bed tank would not be viable in my situation. They do make 150+ gallon tanks that are mounted there. As far as cars, I would use a portable Marine fuel tank, and just run Diesel in that for the required Stop/Start sequence, and use the main tank for grease!

Sorry to ramble, but thought I did not properly address this before! There are many more ideas out there in cyberland, so if you need more info....google it!
Mark Prouty
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Re: Free Fuel....Well almost!

Post by Mark Prouty »

Tom Root wrote:I am picking up my 1st load today, and will be about 3 weeks till my exhaust smells like french fries.
Please keep us informed of your results from this fascinating topic. Once you have your F-250 Ford Diesel running on it, I'm interested in knowing if it performs as expected and if you feel you can maintain the effort.
Tom Root wrote:And you guys are "green" also by owning a sail boat
Yea, but I bought a Tahoe to tow it. :?

I wonder if your supply of grease will diminish if fuel prices continue to rise. Others such as yourself or commercial ventures could compete for this resource.
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Mark, that is a very important part of the equasion, to have a readily accessable supply, I have found by my four different supply locations, so far gathered, that I appeal to the owner or manager in a friendly fashion, abide by their expressed wishes in how to pick up, keep it all clean, supply my own barrels, and the most important step, to patronize their eatery when they are there, to show them it is appreciated!

I realize someone may capitalize on this idea very soon, but for now, it is a small, grassroots effort to be "greener", it appears to work out just fine.....time will of course tell, I am keeping records and logs of time & materials, and if I may indulge this crowd in the future, I'd be glad to impart my experiences, if it is welcomed here?
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Tom Root
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Post by Tom Root »

Update- My order arrived from Greasel.com today. It was well engineered, but still have to figure out exactly how to mount a few things? It was a total of $601.00 for the CK-Tankless-SR kit. I ordered a 5 pack of the Large, prefilters, and also got the premium 12 volt pump kit for transferring the gold stuff!


More to follow,as time permits......Now I gotta get busy, between the multitude of Mac mods, and now my Greasel endeavor....gotta find more time for sailing!!! :)
Mark Prouty
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Post by Mark Prouty »

Looking forward to learning when the your truck smells as good as McDonalds! :) I wonder if in a small way your project will increase fast food sales in your area.

I appreciate you posting the progress of your project.

Thanks,
Mark
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